Daily Community Chat Megathread

AutoModerator · 2023-04-15T01:00:11+00:00

This daily thread is designed to be a place for all the funny discussions on PPD. Feel free to post off-topic questions, information, points-of-view, etc... in...

[–]Maffioze24M Egalitarian [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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[–]LillthOfBabylon [score hidden] 3 years ago* (9 children) | Copy Link

[–]Maffioze24M Egalitarian [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

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[–]LillthOfBabylon-1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

This conversation was literally about having an in-group vs an out-group bias and somehow you blamed men for having an out-group bias and not being like women

Yes. Either accept that fact or change it.

when it's way more logical to say in-group biases are worse when you look at human history.

Are you serious?! Wars and hate crimes were far more common in the past than they are now. Even with the hate white people get, atleast theyre not lynched nor is it allowed.

You're blaming people for biological instincts, how exactly does this work?

Because humans are not brainless monkeys. Adults are expected to have common sense and intelligence.

These things can't be removed they can only be acknowledged

Then stop blaming other people when “following you instincts” fucks you over. Personal responsibility.

so people can make a conscious effort to not be completely ruled by them.

Exactly, so no excuses.

Why is your idea that men have to develop an in group bias

Because theyre the ones bitching about the consequences.

[–]Maffioze2 points 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Yes. Either accept that fact or change it.

Why do only men have to change it? Why do you ignore that a situation where everyone has in group bias leads to less human wellbeing?

Are you serious?! Wars and hate crimes were far more common in the past than they are now. Even with the hate white people get, atleast theyre not lynched nor is it allowed.

They were also the result of in group bias. In group bias is broader than gender.

Because humans are not brainless monkeys. Adults are expected to have common sense and intelligence.

Yes. That doesn't mean you have to believe in an illusion that people can completely remove their biological conditioning.

Then stop blaming other people when “following you instincts” fucks you over. Personal responsibility.

I don't blame anyone. I see everyone as responsible for creating harm to other people.

Exactly, so no excuses.

No excuses for women either?

Because theyre the ones bitching about the consequences.

Ah yes because whenever someone is bitching about the consequences that were also caused by others they have to gaslight themselves into thinking its all their own fault?

I believe in an egalitarian society. In group biases in general and especially in group gender biases are sexist and dangerous from the perspective of human wellbeing. You're literally blaming men for not being sexist enough, how does this even make sense?

[–]Liftaboveall [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

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[–]Ikkyu-Soju4 points 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Manosphere content tells men to rape women.

That is just almost definitely not true. Do bad actors with ulterior motives enter ideologies such as these and spew toxic shit? Definitely.

Just like with feminism you'll find people who take advantage of that and say kill all men, men are disposable, men are violent, we should do this and that. And ironically feminism has violence perpetuated by one of its founders, whereas the violent stuff said by manosphere people is through remote unrelated individuals.

In her early career, Gearhart took part in a series of seminars at San Francisco State University, where feminist scholars were critically discussing issues of rape, slavery, and the possibility of nuclear annihilation. Gearhart outlines a three-step proposal for female-led social change from her essay, "The Future–-If There Is One–-is Female":

I) Every culture must begin to affirm a female future.

II) Species responsibility must be returned to women in every culture.

III) The proportion of men must be reduced to and maintained at approximately 10% of the human race.

Gearhart does not base this radical proposal on the idea that men are innately violent or oppressive, but rather on the "real danger is in the phenomenon of male-bonding, that commitment of groups of men to each other whether in an army, a gang, a service club, a lodge, a monastic order, a corporation, or a competitive sport." Gearhart identifies the self-perpetuating, male-exclusive reinforcement of power within these groups as corrosive to female-led social change. Thus, if "men were reduced in number, the threat would not be so great and the placement of species responsibility with the female would be assured." Gearhart, a dedicated pacifist, recognized that this kind of change could not be achieved through mass violence. On the critical question of how women could achieve this, Gearhart argues that it is by women's own capacity for reproduction that the ratio of men to women can be changed though the technologies of cloning or ovular merging, both of which would only produce female births. She argues that as women take advantage of these reproductive technologies, the sex ratio would change over generations.[14]

Daphune Patal in her book Heterophobia: Sexual Harassment and the Future of Feminism summarizes Gearhart's essay as, "The future must be in female hands, women alone must control the reproduction of species; and only 10% of the population should be allowed to be male".[15]

Mary Daly supported Gearhart's proposals, stating: "I think it's not a bad idea at all. If life is to survive on this planet, there must be a decontamination of the Earth. I think this will be accompanied by an evolutionary process that will result in a drastic reduction of the population of males."[16]

Feminism is also very dangerous for autistic female teens as it's a sure way to become radicalized and becoming very, very anti-male and cultivating a lot of unhealthy personal traits like a victim mentality, severe in-group bias amongst women, lack of empathy towards the opposite gender and so on...

[–]satisfiedmind-1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Ikkyu-Soju2 points 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Can you use a little bit more nuance?

Andrew Tate's huge fame has a lot of factors involved in it, and if you believe he's famous because the majority of men are as violent and as dismissive as the character he portrays then you're delusional. You are also being indigenous by saying that the manosphere is dangerous because it calls for violence, but it does not. It simply calls for a shift in perspective in a society that doesn't care much for men's health in a lot of aspects and that it should be pro-claimed by the individual because if you don't help yourself no one would, and ironically this is one of the reasons Andrew Tate grew famous because other than being completely politically incorrect which was a breath of fresh air he was also very direct and simple in his approach, "I don't give a shit about you, you're a fucking loser, you're fat sac piece of shit. You don't deserve anything and everyone feels exactly just like me It's just that I have the decency to say it." that was his appeal. Was he troublesome? Yes, I think he was misogynistic and held very troubling views about the relationship between men and women, but to say violence is over the top, unless you can measure and count subtle forms of psychological violence that almost definitely pile up to become physical, but everything is like that, feminism included.

Just because you only care about women's issues doesn't make men's issues any less important and immediate. 80% of suicide rates are men and we're living in a very hostile society towards them as young boys grow up from a very young age learning that there is something wrong with them and they see girls their own age celebrated all over whereas they're just jizz filled teenagers that no one gives a shit about.

The quotes I've used ripple throughout our feminist-monopolized society.

[–]satisfiedmind-1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Ikkyu-Soju1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

We are both delusional. We both have different ideas about the world and we base our conclusions on that. You care too much about women's side and them being affected by it, which I can see but I think you're exaggerating the degree of effect. In the same vein, you don't care about the other side because you're a woman and it doesn't affect you personally, it doesn't affect the people of your group who you are biased towards(other women), and it is pushed and celebrated by a lot of people thus social validity. You have no incentive to see things from the majority of men's perspective and that is why you don't see the benefits of it or hugely downplay them and of course only see the negative sides and blow them out to big proportions.

But such is life, everyone is stuck in their own little bubbles to protect their little unconscious forms of self-interests.

[–]satisfiedmind-1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Delusional doesn’t mean having different ideas about the world.

You have made a lot of assertions about the way I think or feel but you don’t have evidence. You are projecting what you think women on this sub think and feel on to me. You don’t know my exact thoughts and feelings. We all have biases, but what matters is what we are doing to challenge them. You don’t know what I’m doing to work on areas where I have bias. I think I’m actually pretty more proactive with this than most.

I understand it might seem as though I’m exaggerating but I’m not, it really is and will have a profound effect on young women. It already is very damaging. When there’s violence in a home it interrupts normal brain development. Leads to homicides. Toll on mental health services from people traumatised by it. Violence against women is a very big problem. In fact part of the reason Andrew Tate exists is because he grew up witnessing DV. I haven’t been able to avoid being exposed to this stuff. I’ve lived it and I’ve been besides friends while they live it too. Of course I’m going to care.

[–]Ikkyu-Soju1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Nothing changed.

The way you view the ideas that might negatively affect women is vastly different than the way you view the deep-rooted ideas we have in our society that negatively affect men and young boys. I am not projecting this into you, this is a very clear bias that anyone who lived in the West has with constant talks of feminism, Women's victimization, Men's demonization, and so on...

There are a plethora of ideas that negatively affect men to a ridiculous degree that they grow up hating themselves, empty, feeling unworthy, feeling alienated, and so on... But no one talks about them to the degree that everyone jumped on Andrew Tate because he perpetuates ideas that might hurt our women.

You said to stop young men under 25 from consuming manosphere content, I said to stop young women from frequenting feminist spaces and content.

You view these things differently because you have a bias that affects how you view one vs the other. I see both as equally troublesome and similar in a lot of ways.

[–]satisfiedmind-1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Ikkyu-Soju1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

The fact that I don't agree with a point doesn't mean I don't see it. I see what you mean by projection and I don't agree with it.

There are documented studies on the empathy gap and the women are wonderful effect coupled with us living in a pro-"liberal" society with strong emphasis in personal morality and that morality is dictated by our huge companies, media, organizations, and shit.

The average person growing up amidst of these unending streams of that attempts to shape one's mind always go in a single direction, and that direction is detrimental to men. 80% of suicides are men, the gradual decline of the work force, college graduates among men, sexlessness, loss of meaning, and so on...

My point is, yes I do see the negative effects on women that you speak of, they are deplorable and should be dealt with. However, your answer to dealing with those things comes from a particular point of view, or rather a whole world view that doesn't necessarily correlate with the real world, or it does but you just don't see the mountain of negative effects that men deal with in that aspect or you just don't care.

Let's agree to disagree. You're like that, "Oh my god Tate is ruining students at school.", but you never blinked an eye when those girls at school were doing the exact same thing to those boys.

Let's agree to disagree, these biases are deeply rooted and a conversation with a inhuman avatar in reddit isn't really the answer.

Whatever negative effects feminism has on men does not even come close to the damage caused by misogyny to women.

I hope you can realize that this is a subjective statement driven by your incomplete knowledge of the fact and your feelings about the matter. The truth could be either way.

[–]satisfiedmind-1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Ikkyu-Soju1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

We have different opinions because we are troubled creatures and because we've had different life experiences we seek refuge in ideas that are different from one another, and in that security, we lose ourselves. We keep on trying to protect our ideas because after all hidden underneath them is our pain, and in our active and constant attempts at escaping our sorrows only grow, and our dysfunction deepens. I am doing my fair share, I doubt everything there is about myself. Although we disagree now, if both of us are courageous enough to drop it all a fundamental change is bound to occur so that we will see the same thing.

Till your mud settles and the water is clear? Can you remain unmoving. Till the right action arises by itself?” - Lao Tzu.

Thanks for entertaining me till now, if I was antagonistic at times do forgive.

[–]satisfiedmind-1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

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[–]Ikkyu-Soju1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I did not say he wasn't violent. I said the core of what everything manosphere is not violent.

The reason he said that was because of the craziness and "edginess" of it if you will. You know sometimes we make dark jokes not because we actually believe the things said in those jokes, but to just make fun of that immorality and entertain actively by creating those scenarios without any nefarious intentions.

That was his gimmick, to say the most outlandish things. It's clearly a satire because you don't see him saying shit like that with real people.

Forget Tate I don't care for him, my only concern is that you're using a very overly critical lens to approach him, which I think is a necessary lens in some cases to view things, but why aren't you also looking at his counterpart? The women who say, do, and perpetuate some very unhealthy behavior that doesn't necessarily lose out to him, that's my biggest beef with the Tate hate.

You don't care how a young boy will grow up in a single parent home learning about toxic masculinity from his precious mother that he grows up resenting all women, too many of such cases yet where are these righteous citizens to make things right?

[–]satisfiedmind-1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

“You don’t care about how a young boy will grow up in a single parent home learning toxic masculinity “ umm, I am very much concerned about a young boy learning toxic masculinity. They learn it from abusive fathers. Tate is incredibly harmful, you can try to minimise it by saying it’s for “shock value” but the autistic kids don’t necessarily get that, they take everything literally … hence my suggesting the age limit.

You realise women are dying because of these attitudes? When they get extreme you try to distance yourself, but ultimately the values the manosphere promotes are used as justification for violence against women. If you track the psychology of these perpetrators back it comes down to these beliefs about women. That’s why they’ve been identified as dangerous.

“Why aren’t you looking at his counterpart?” Because they’re not making the news for violence against men. It’s barely happening. Meanwhile we are still surrounded by violence against women, and now these manosphere influencers have come in and are giving men justification and excuses for their abusive behaviour.

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[–]satisfiedmind-2 points 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Few reasons.
Firstly they use specific tactics to hook you in, similar to cults. So they’ll provide all the “answers” to “questions” young men have but don’t verbalise. Same happens if Jehovah’s Witness come to your door, they’ll ask you if you have ever questioned [insert common existential crisis question] and tell you they have the answers. Make the most complicated of topics seem simple. They make the person who feels powerless feel like they could be powerful, if they just follow the commands of the influencer, they can change their situation. Often they can’t.
They provide a rule book to one of the most confusing complex areas of life - relationships. For autistic young men this is ideal.

The reality is these guys need therapy. They have difficult work to do in therapy on self esteem, value etc. They don’t need some guy telling them to oppress women and view them as animals.

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[–]satisfiedmind-1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Ah I see your age. 24.

Everything happens in context, so the past is relevant.

I get that it feels invalidating to hear these feminist arguments in defence to the problems you perceive are facing men. How much have you experienced these problems irl? As opposed to learning that they are issues facing men through watching RP content?

The reality is women are still victim blamed, women are much more frequently victims of sexual violence so naturally more women are victim blamed. I get that men also can be victims and find it very difficult to speak up, come forward and be taken seriously. That’s a real shame. But a lot of the feminist activists you dislike have actually experienced this stuff first hand in their youth. We are still supporting friends who go through it. It’s not something we have found on the internet and been told we are oppressed, we live it.

Look dude, things happen in context. Women are still being victim Blake

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[–]RocinanteCoffee1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

First of all, you know exactly what I was referring to (people parading naked infront of children).

Again, Superbowl half time shows, every car show in Miami (and LA), Mardi Gras, Carnivale, all of these things are parading nude or mostly nude people in front of children. If you don't want your kid to attend a parade don't take them to a parade. But make sure straight couples aren't also announcing their anniversary in a restaurant and kissing and wearing wedding rings.

For the record as long as someone isn't sexualizing the child or directing advances at a child there is nothing wrong with pageantry. Parents can make the decision of what they think is inappropriate dress but you can't prepare your child for the world if the first time they see an NFL cheerleader in a bikini shaking her ass at the quarterback they think they're in danger.

The only people who are a danger to children are child predators. Parades are just pageantry. Drag shows are just theater.

If you don't want your kid at Hooters don't take them to Hooters. But unless your town has a strict ordinance on what people wear they are going to see their neighbors in all manner of dress. And even then the moment they step out of town or go elsewhere.

If someone is touching or flirting with your child they are a predator. Even adjusting for how many more straight people there are than gay, based on rates of child harm and percentages straight people are far more likely to harm children than gay people.

But I don't fear straight people or just broadly think they're all bad influences just because the dudes may go shirtless with bike shorts to a Miami car show with their bikini-topped wife in tow.

[–]RocinanteCoffee1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

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I wouldn't consider it that way.

If my partner said he wanted more sex I'd be delighted and say 'sure, when?'.

Now if some random person on the internet is trying to say that if they and their colleagues don't get sex they're going to do something drastic and try to hold people hostage to it that's entirely different.

If someone tries to lie about how important sex with another person is for health then they should be called out. You can protect your prostate and keep your dick from atrophying just as much by regular masturbation.

Human connection is necessary for human health for almost all persons, however, that human connection in order to fulfill the needs of well-being does not have to be romantic/sexual in nature.

I say this as someone who desires and thirsts for sex regularly every day and someone who seeks out sexually compatible people who have at least some similar ideas about frequency and quality of sex.

Wanting sex and wanting more sex is utterly natural. Thinking it's anyone's problem but one's own is not.

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My parents are rich enough to cover entire generations

I have been to 75 countries, 7 continents, 6 Super Bowls, 4 World Cups, met billionaires, famous politicians and even some famous athletes/celebrities

They have zero issues funding my sister and me. For my part alone I went to an Ivy League school and graduated with honors/got into med school (in a gap year right now)

In high school when I was stupid I invited a girl to the Super Bowl and to the private plane my family owned then (rejected--politely but yeah). I don't do cringy stuff like that now but still

The one time I tried OLD the pictures used were me on horseback in the African Savannah with giraffes in the background, on a jet ski in Dubrovnik with King's Landing in the background, me with Travis Kelce trying on his Super Bowl ring (first one--he hadn't won the second yet), in a suite at the World Cup final and a few others that made no effort to hide the money

Besides that since graduating last year I've basically lived in the gym when not traveling and overhauled my wardrobe

Only thing left is to try living in a bigger city this summer (I've lived my whole life besides college in a mid sized almost all white midwestern town--I am ethnically Indian)

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I am not as rich as you but I have some Indian friends who has your level of cash. Think New Delhi mega-corporation money.

One guy had no problem getting women because he’s 6’2” and looks like a Bollywood actor. But the other guy was kinda scrawny and awkward. He got a pretty hot girlfriend in the end. His strategy was basically to do fun rich people things (F1, Coachella VIP, ski trips) and post a ton to social media. Then he’d link the social media to his apps and use it for clout.

Thing is, these guys are multimillionaires but it wasn’t trivially easy to get white sorority girls. If you’re Indian in a US school, unless you are good looking it can be hard.

Move to a big city, especially NYC, there are more hot girls from Europe who are less anti-Indian, and people there respect money and education more.

[–]Brief_Crab_37101 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I have a pretty nice Instagram but it just recently turned public (my parents insisted on private for years prior) and fairly limited in number of followers. I realize it might be self sabotage and something I should just get over but the idea of posting my life on social media for relative strangers to like is just so weird and seems like showing off

Unless I know and feel generally positive about a person connecting with them on social media just gives me an ICK

I've heard the big city thing too. It's just a little scary for someone who has lived his whole life in a small town (besides college where I was overworked and miserable) to go to a place I'd be some nobody just for the chance of improved prospects. I was born here, am comfortable here even not being able to get girls, have roots here, live and breathe the local sports teams, hell I even know the politicians here

I'm trying it in small doses this summer when I'll be in Miami and Minneapolis for a month. If it goes well I'll shoot for residency in a big city I suppose

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What do you mean this chart, there's 5 fucking charts there. Secondly you link a blog which on that website they put it in the blog section. Then you have the fact the chart says "Source: General Social Survey cross-sectional data 1989-2021." This means they used many data sources, allegedly, and yet they do not happen to list a single god damn citation. Another interesting thing about this site is I could literally go to the blog section & see another article titled "Feminism's Failures, which you probably would pretend didn't exist. Also my initial request was for stats, that are not anecdotal, that are peer reviewed and verified. If these are peer reviewed and verified then why the hell did not list a single citation? I had to cite shit for my psychology course & some other classes I took. You expect me to take this shit seriously without any citations? Get fucking real.

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Even though I've gotten to a better place than I was when I used to visit this subreddit more, it's still so forever apparent how unfortunate it is to have to deal with such disparate gender experiences. The fact that men and women have different interests, agendas, and tendencies of thought just makes personal connection harder to find and attain.

And even when you find a like-minded person who's somewhat a fit for you, they're leading a different life than you because of their gender. I have a female friend who gets dozens of messages from horny guys daily, and so even though we like each other, and are both horny people, she's just got a different experience than me. She never feels desperate for sexual partners, she gets constant personal reinforcement of her attractiveness and desirability, she gets constant offers for ways to make money off of her feminine attractiveness...and she's simply just busy all the time with attention from a huge variety of people, whereas my inbox can sometimes be dry as a bone.

She's a nice person, and I can't honestly say I would do anything that different in her shoes, but it's just the nature of the world and gendered sexualities that causes a disconnect, and that's really kinda sad.

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If 'knows what she's doing' involves putting herself out there in the hopes of finding people she might be into, then sure. I'm doing the exact same thing. I'm just saying that she's naturally going to get significantly more attention than I am due to the nature of social media and male/female gender disparities. So even though we might wander in similar social circles, and not be far apart personally, her experience is just going to be quite different from mine, and unfortunately that does create some natural disconnect between us.

For example, I have had the experience of talking to a LOT of people on Tinder at the same time, and it's just a natural human thing that you can only split your attention so many places. So, in other circumstances people I might be interested to talk to might fall by the wayside, or it will take me longer to get back to them because my attention is elsewhere, or simply my general need for interaction with other humans is being fulfilled without needing them for it as much. So if you imagine someone on the other end who through some circumstance has only me, or not much more than me, to talk to and pursue social and sexual interaction with...you get how the situation can cause issues between us.

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I don’t understand why you want to link feminism with DV against men. Unfortunately, due to the power difference, hormonal differences, and historical income difference, women are much more likely to be seriously injured or killed from DV.

They also have historically been less likely to have money that would allow them to leave a dangerous situation. When a woman is unemployed (SAHMs were much more prevalent in the 70s and 80s), she is more likely to experience DV and cannot leave the situation easily, especially with children.

Given the high-visibility of DV against women and the financial need they had when leaving a dangerous situation, feminists advocated for greater government supports and legal changes to support women experiencing DV.

At the time, very few men admitted that they experienced DV and their physical injuries and financial need were less apparent. That is still the case, though men and women are more likely to both contribute to family income these days. Men have started advocating for better supports for male DV victims, which is a great thing.

But that doesn’t mean that feminism should be blamed for the lack of supports for men. Feminism had a tremendous fight on their hands to put supports in place for women.

[–]Maffioze1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I don’t understand why you want to link feminism with DV against men.

I don't understand why you (and others) constantly try to frame this as a completely free choice that I'm making because I want to link feminism with DV against men. I don't want to link feminism with DV against men, it just happens to be linked and I'm simply saying that's the case. I don't know about you but I don't believe in solipsism.

Unfortunately, due to the power difference, hormonal differences, and historical income difference, women are much more likely to be seriously injured or killed from DV.

I have literally not denied that a single time in conversations about this topic. This is the minority of DV and definitely not the only way in which DV can harm a victim's health (physical and mental).

They also have historically been less likely to have money that would allow them to leave a dangerous situation. When a woman is unemployed (SAHMs were much more prevalent in the 70s and 80s), she is more likely to experience DV and cannot leave the situation easily, especially with children.

I agree, but I don't see the relevance.

Given the high-visibility of DV against women and the financial need they had when leaving a dangerous situation, feminists advocated for greater government supports and legal changes to support women experiencing DV.

But that's not where it ended. When Erin Pizzey created the Duluth model and her shelter she herself realised that her theory wasn't accurate but then she was bullied out of her own shelter by militant feminists. She also received bomb threats and had to leave her own country because of that. This continued onwards from that point where academics (including women) who dared to report on the fact that domestic violence as a whole isn't gendered where intimidated, received bomb and death threats, got their dog killed, and got their children threatened.

At the same time the academic side of domestic violence started to develop in which scientific evidence was consistently distorted and hidden away, in which completely unrepresentative samples were used to justify the sexist and completely inaccurate feminist understanding of DV that clearly harmed male victims because they were themselves arrested. They basically used circular reasoning through their own biased policies to conclude that the data that was generated through these biased policies actually supported the use of their biased policies. Most of the data that was actually representative was ignored by those fields.

This continues to this day, the idea that domestic violence is a gendered issue continues to be dominant in academia and governmental policy despite the fact that so many studies find that it isn't. Academia is filled with misandrist papers that dismiss male suffering, that deem them as unimportant sidepieces that don't matter unless they can frame another man as the offender and that make up pseudoscientific theories because being feminist is more important than being true/accurate. One of the most highest cited papers on DV even tries to argue that men are lesser victims just because they are less likely to see themselves as victims and because they feel less anxious. All of this intertwined with organisations such as the UN and law convention such as the "violence against women act" and these are themselves connected to feminist organisations and their supporters.

I truly don't understand why it is so hard for you to see eye to eye on this with me. Just like you I also believe in secularism. But that also includes that academia should be trying to figure out how the universe works instead of following dogma, ideology and agenda's which ultimately harms everyone. Because this really harms everyone not just men; when the understanding of DV is not accurate it means that prevention and protection will be less efficiënt , it means male victims feel even more stigmatised and don't get enough help, it means that more women are murdered every day because studies show the murder rate drops when DV victims are able to get help... sometimes a murder is the last resort of a desperate victim to escape.

Men have started advocating for better supports for male DV victims, which is a great thing.

That's barely anything compared to what the world at large is moving towards. In multiple European countries laws are being changed that make the exact same offense more punishable when its a man doing it to a woman.

But that doesn’t mean that feminism should be blamed for the lack of supports for men.

Its not a question of should. Its a question of who IS to blame. They are to blame because they are ones who atleast partly caused this situation.

[–]liefelijk1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

the idea that domestic violence is a gendered issue

Unfortunately, it is still a gendered issue. The disparity of physical size and aggression between men and women leads to more women being killed and seriously injured by their domestic partner. They also are still more likely to need shelter and financial support to exit abusive situations.

it means that more women are murdered every day because studies show the murder rate drops when DV victims are able to get help... sometimes a murder is the last resort of a desperate victim to escape.

DV victims are significantly more likely to be murdered when they have received help and are trying to leave an abusive situation. It’s by far the most dangerous point.

In multiple European countries laws are being changed that make the exact same offense more punishable when its a man doing it to a woman.

Can you give me an example of what you mean?

Its not a question of should. Its a question of who IS to blame. They are to blame because they are ones who atleast partly caused this situation.

Feminists creating the shelter system and changing laws so DV is actually prosecuted has been an enormous help for both male and female victims. The fact that we’re even talking about male victims today is thanks to feminism.

[–]Maffioze1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Unfortunately, it is still a gendered issue. The disparity of physical size and aggression between men and women leads to more women being killed and seriously injured by their domestic partner. They also are still more likely to need shelter and financial support to exit abusive situations.

Domestic violence isn't a gendered issue. Murder and severe injuries are a gendered issue.

DV victims are significantly more likely to be murdered when they have received help and are trying to leave an abusive situation. It’s by far the most dangerous point.

This has nothing to do with what I said, but I agree.

Can you give me an example of what you mean?

https://www.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/sfj2bw/we\_live\_in\_a\_dystopia\_spanish\_courts\_for\_violence/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3

Feminists creating the shelter system and changing laws so DV is actually prosecuted has been an enormous help for both male and female victims. The fact that we’re even talking about male victims today is thanks to feminism.

And white people have been an enormous help for black people because they invented modern technology and healthcare?

This argument is ridiculous to me, sorry.

[–]liefelijk1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

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My reading level in French is not good enough to understand the sources. How is sentencing actually written in the law?

I translated it for you:

Another controversial point: since the 2003 amendment, article 153 provides that the perpetrator will be sanctioned by a higher penalty if the victim of occasional violence is or was his wife, or a woman with whom he was related by a similar emotional relationship.  Including if they do not live together; conversely, the sanction will be less if the victim is the male partner or another person from the family. Paradoxically, stronger protection for victims.

In the scientific literature, some authors point out that this provision constituted a breach of the principle of equality because men were more severely sanctioned than women for the same behavior and because the law granted stronger protection to female victims than to those of the male sex.

And before you think this source is biased in my favour, they argue that this is a good thing.

This argument, based on the breach of the principle of equality, can however be firmly refuted. First, it must be emphasized, as Johnson does, that men and women are not equally involved in casual violence within a couple; the violence does not present gender symmetry at all (the man being the perpetrator in about 90% of the cases).

This 90% is factually incorrect like I told you in my previous comment. They are clearly lying.

In addition, there are considerable differences in terms of the nature and consequences of violence committed by men and women; women are more likely than men to be seriously injured, to fear for their safety and to experience negative psychological consequences

The first thing is true, the other things are completely ridiculous to use as an argument.

Also, a woman beating a man is not the same as a man beating a woman. Not if we really believe that violence against women is a structural problem rooted in the ancestral subordination of women and the inequality in the distribution of social roles. A differentiated sanction on the basis of these differences could be legitimized; this is what the Spanish Constitutional Court has also indicated, since one of the aspects of the principle of equality involves treating different cases differently  

Using the pseudoscientific theory of patriarchal violence that has no scientific proof at all to claim "its different" that is also used in the Duluth model.

When modern-day Feminists started advocating for changes to DV law, they had almost no representation in government. Women definitely did not have control over policy.

And they gradually gained power and abused it which is why they are to blame. Also I'm talking about feminists, not women.

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I see why you'd think. The majority of people aren't narcissists of course in the ways they view themselves and other people, but people are of course malleable and can cultivate extremely unhealthy psychological traits without there being any sort of neurological impact and that's where religions and ideologies come in. The atrocities that were done in the name of religion and ideology by the average person are astounding so it is not surprising that current ideologies affect some of the ways we look at some groups of people. LGBT and their "straight white male", feminism and their male, and the manosphere with the female.

What I find troublesome though is why is it widely accepted in our society that the first two options are somewhat valid and only the last one is toxic. All of them are disturbed and unhinged equally.

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*10 or higher looks wise, <100 lbs, knowledge to cook without cookbooks or recipes. Virgin or less than 2 previous partners, but must be willing to do all kinds of sex acts and sex daily.

Huh? Did you have a stroke writing this?

10 is very rare and there's no higher than that in 1-10 scale, if that's what you meant. Most guys are fine with a solid 6 or 7.

Huge in-between about not wanting a fat woman, especially when you are fit yourself, and wanting a girl who doesn't weigh more than 100lbs, which is really skinny and probably won't have curves.

Some guys are strict about n-count, yeah, and you chose to focus on those, but some don't care and most just don't want a girl who fucked dozens of guys out there.

Yeah, men want a girl who's sexually attracted to him and compatible, too.

Also, why did you forgot putting women's physical standards for men and just put cutesy "kind, nice teehee" traits?

Seems like some low effort non-serious post, honestly.

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10 or higher is literally impossible, I think most men are happy with a 6 who's thin and enthusiastic in bed, but 7 is the ideal. <100lbs is also an exaggeration. I will say the men here seem to be really picky about weight, moreso than women, but 100lbs? Come on.

Sexual compatibility is important, and I more often hear that they just want the same sexual enthusiasm and treatment as she has given previous partners. Finding someone who shares your sexual values is important. It's not hard to not rack up a high n count, so it's not asking much.

Women also do this. Sexual incompatibility is a concern for both genders, and often for women that includes dick size. It's also a joke that you don't mention height or looks are something women care about at all. I've heard women say they rarely happen across a man they find attractive, whereas men will find the majority of healthy weight women attractive enough.

I'm not saying men aren't somewhat picky in their own right, but if it were really so bad you wouldn't have to use ridiculous exaggerations to get your point across. You way overstated what men expect and totally understated what women expect. You're behaving exactly like the men who screech that women only want chad.

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As you've pointed out, men are far picker and specific about their appearance requirements. Making their standards taller.

Where did I point this out? I literally said women are more picky. I've heard men here say they see plenty of pretty women daily, whereas a lot of women have said they only find 10% of men attractive, at best.

The only thing I said is yea men care about weight, probably moreso than women. I would venture a guess women still want a man with a healthy weight though.

Plenty of women care about dick size. When was the last time an average sized dildo made decent sales? Oh wait! They don't exist.

If you want to take comments from this sub and compare men and female standards, don't take the highest of men's and the lowest of women's, that's disingenuous.

Even wanting low "n" doesn't mean only wanting 2 or less. Sure if you take the absolute highest standards, some men want a virgin (hell, I'm a woman and I had that standard too). But the majority of men just don't want to date a slut, which is not unreasonable. I'd assume a lot of women wouldn't want to date manwhores either.

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[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (20 children) | Copy Link

Lots of women in feminist spaces and online seem to be confused about something. Men not wanting to date a woman or type of woman for whatever reason is not restricting her freedom. You are free to live your life how you want, but a man is free to form an opinion of you regarding your actions and how you present yourself, and a man is entirely free to not want to marry that kind of woman, or at best, to only have sex with her.

If we choose to commit to a certain type of woman and not to others, that's not us trying to drag women back to the stone age or something.

If there's a woman who's traditional minded and we want to marry her, and we don't want to marry a woman who's the opposite of that, that's not us trying to drag women into oppression.

You have your own choices and your own freedom, and that comes with consequences, for example certain men will not want to commit to you and will not see you as wife material.

[–]Ainsleygz [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

You should preach the same to men who find women's preferences offending because they exclude them from their dating pool.

I don't give a shit. I once saw a woman here say she wouldn't date a guy who watches anime or has anime figurines or something like that, and i was like, she's obviously an idiot, but its not something that bothers me cause for me, that in itself signals that she's the opposite of my type so I lose nothing by not being in her dating pool.

Having said that people can criticize certain preferences not because they get excluded by them (although it does happen), but for various other reasons like for being shallow or hypocritical. It's okay. People criticizing your preferences don't restrict your freedom.

My issue isn't people criticising preferences but specifically women who act like men having preferences is some kind of oppression towards them or trying to drag them back to the stone age.

[–]EulenWatcherEgalitarian feminist [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

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I remember a few years ago, I worked with this girl who was too young for me. Well, too young to be legal, and I also felt like she was immature. She always bragged to me about her 'older boyfriend' who was my age. She never told me anything about him, except that he was white and older than her. She viewed him basically as a trophy.

One day, she randomly texts me that she broke up with him. And I knew she liked me because she flirted with me all of the time. I don't know if she broke up with her boyfriend because of me, but I wouldn't put it past her.

The entire vibe of the conversation was her telling me she broke up with her boyfriend and that now I can date her. Like she chose me and I was a participant with no autonomy in the decision. That's how it felt. And when I rejected her, she was behaving as though I was already her boyfriend. She was saying shit like "this is so you, you would do something like this to me", like I had known her and dated her for years.

Anyways, moral of the story: bitches be crazy

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[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

It's true though. I've noticed it. Women are loved for who they are, men are loved for what they do or can do. Men are never loved for who they are, men are loved for what they bring to the table. Men are always questioned on what they can do or fix or offer to someone else or offer to society. A man who doesn't do stuff is considered a worthless man.

Whereas for women, a woman can do nothing and still be loved and cherished just for existing. A woman can be an unemployed NEET and men will still be lining up to marry her and love her.

When men see a crying woman, they go into protective mode. When a man cries, nobody gets protective over him, its more like "why are you crying? Do something about your problem and fix it."

This isn't some misogynist seething, this is literally what I've observed time and time again in life.

[–]AstronautLoveShackSuccubus Demon whose every motive is pure evil [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You're misunderstanding my point, I'm not saying women aren't doing things. I'm saying women's values aren't perceived as based on what they do or can do. If a woman doesn't do all that stuff you mentioned, she won't be seen as worthless. Men will still love her and want to be with her. If a woman doesn't have a job or education, it won't mean that pretty much 0% of men want to date her. Whereas if a man doesn't have a job or education, pretty much 0% of women will want to date her.

A woman could be a jobless NEET, could have very few practical skills, and men will still love her and want to date her because she's pretty, she's kind, she makes them feel warm, whatever.

A guy who is a jobless NEET will have literally no one wanting to date him, even if he's very kind and handsome, people will be like, he brings nothing to the table, he can do nothing, therefore he has no value.

A woman who's vulnerable and weak will still have value because men will want to protect her, she has inherent value just by existing, and so men and society will want to protect her.

A man who's vulnerable and weak will have no value. People will be like, he's useless, he can't do anything, why do we need him?

Why do you think the majority of homeless people are men? When a man falls through the cracks of society, nobody cares because once he's down there, he can't offer anything, he has no value. When a woman falls through the cracks of society, she still has value, so people try to help get her back on her feet again.

[–]AstronautLoveShack1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]dbz__f1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I get that, in modern western countries there are lots of social services and they don't take advantage of them. But my point stands, society doesn't despair for a homeless man the way that it does for a homeless women. Whenever there's a war or tragedy, it's always like, if the victims were women and children, that's underlined. Their lives are more valuable.

If you and me were on the titanic, you'd get on a lifeboat and I'd drown to death, because I have a dangly thing between my legs and you don't. That makes your life more worthy of preserving in the eyes of society. That's how its always been. Nobody considers the fact that men also don't want to die. Men also want to live, just as much as women do.

When I was a kid, I cried a lot and nobody gave a fuck, my dad would say "men don't cry". That's it. Men can't have feelings or be vulnerable, we have to work on finding solutions otherwise we're useless. Do you think he ever said that to my sister? Hell no. When a girl cries, the whole world tries to comfort her.

Which comes back to Lilith's point, she was being brutally honest. A man being emotionally weak and vulnerable makes her disgusted because that's how society at large views weak and vulnerable men. Most won't admit it because it sounds cruel but she was being 100% honest.

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Because spending as a government doesn't follow the same logic as spending as a household.

I don't know how it works in the US, but here the courts are funded by the government. Removal of child support would reduce the burden on the courts and would decrease administrative costs. It would also decrease the amount of men send to prison. I don't think prisons are very productive economically (except for the owners of private prisons, which I find disgusting).

Its also possible that financial abortion will change people's behaviour and that it will have positive indirect (also financial) consequences. For example if it results in less baby trapping because abusive women can't control their partner that way and if women can no longer use kids a way to get money from rich men less unloved/unwanted children will be born which will cost less to society. It will increase the trust of men in women. Women might be more likely to get an abortion if they know beforehand that they will only get a certain amount of money, and if its done through the taxpayer there is a better argument for increased control about whether this money is actually used to help the child. It can also increase the funding for organisations that care about children in general and that will result in a long term cost reduction for society.

Additionally the removal of financial pressure on men makes them less desperate for shitty and dangerous jobs. This will result in less cycles of poverty and more social mobility which can increase the productivity of society as a whole which will result in more tax money. It will also increase the amount of entrepreneurs and businesses since people feel more secure and will be more okay with taking risks. All of this will result in more free competition, more wealth and thus more tax revenue. However small, its something that will work against the power of big corporations that dodge most of their taxes.

This is even ignoring all the ways in which tax money is currently wasted. I don't know about you but I think there are way worse things tax money is currently used on than on supporting children.

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[–]Willow-girlLegendairy [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah, it's a little person in there ... a person who is relying on us to do the right thing.

I was pro-choice for most of my life without really giving it much thought, then last year, I happened to be working in a grade school, and looked out over a lunchroom full of kindergarteners doing cute kindergartener things like playing telephone with a banana, and realized those precious kids' mothers could have murdered them in the womb just a few short years earlier and no one would have cared.

We weep and moan when someone shoots up an elementary school (and rightfully so) but those same children could be killed at a slightly earlier stage of development, for no better reason than their mother's convenience, and that would be heralded as "healthcare" in some quarters.

It seemed like a monstrous evil to me.

[–]Ylduts [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

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If you aren't you do not have to pay child support.

In some cases you do. Some states have a timeframe to contest paternity. If you find out later you still must pay child support. Worse still is some underage boys who were taken advantage of by their female teachers must pay child support.

PHOENIX — Nick Olivas became a father at 14, a fact he wouldn't learn for eight years.

While in high school, Olivas had sex with a 20-year-old woman. As he sees it now, she took advantage of a lonely kid going through a rough patch at home.

State law says a child younger than 15 cannot consent with an adult under any circumstance, making Olivas a rape victim. Olivas didn't press charges and says he didn't realize at the time that it was even something to consider.

The two went their separate ways. Olivas, now 24 and living in Phoenix, graduated from high school, went to college and became a medical assistant.

Then two years ago, the state served him with papers demanding child support. That's how he found out he had a then-6-year-old daughter.

Olivas said he owes about $15,000 in back child support and medical bills going back to the child's birth, plus 10 percent interest. The state seized money from his bank account and is garnisheeing his wages at $380 a month.

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[–]RocinanteCoffee1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Thinking a zygote, embryo, or fetus that is inside someone is equivalent to a born child is not a scientific stance.

Thinking it's ethical to force someone's body to submit to another's even if there was more than philosophical and religious reasons to think a fetus is equivalent to a person, is woefully concerning.

Just as a father needs to give informed and written consent even for the minor, brief, non-risky procedure of donating marrow to even their born toddler of a son, so we should have consent for all people.

Even if you consider a fetus equivalent to a child their freedom ends where the body holding the pregnancy begins.

There is a reason people will save the three infants in pediatrics over the 10,000 embryos in the fertility clinic if they had to choose when the medical campus is on fire.

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[–]Zestyclose_Truth9999early 20sF | partnered up | reality pilled [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]According_Talk_3084 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]jamal_dc [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]jamal_dc [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]DrinkItInMan11Red Pill Man [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]According_Talk_3084 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]jamal_dc [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]jamal_dc [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]AngeCruelleReturn of the insufferable virgin [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]jamal_dc [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]AngeCruelleReturn of the insufferable virgin [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]jamal_dc [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]AngeCruelleReturn of the insufferable virgin [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]jamal_dc [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]AngeCruelle1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]THHBHStTWomen deserve the world [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (33 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Lift_and_LurkNo Pill [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Ok_Bear976Horse Pill [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]liefelijkthat’s *Queen* Camilla to you, thank you very much [score hidden] 3 years ago (27 children) | Copy Link

[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

[–]liefelijkthat’s *Queen* Camilla to you, thank you very much [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]liefelijkthat’s *Queen* Camilla to you, thank you very much [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]RocinanteCoffee1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Lots of men and women with morals frown against the murder of unborn children, which is a very evil act.

Actually most men and women are in support of a woman's right to choose. It is wildly popular in the US at least.

Equating a fetus to a child is illogical but also from a philosophical perspective inaccurate.

Even if we entertained the notion that a fetus is equivalent to a child (I notice abortion protesters would not actually rescue 10,000 embryos in a fertility clinic over even one living baby in pediatrics) it still is never okay to enslave someone's body to another person's.

A dad has to give informed and written consent even for a brief, non-risky, relatively painless marrow donation to his toddler-aged son where he is the only match and the child will die without it.

You cannot take organs from a dead person to support the lives of even adults without their prior consent, or in some cases a legally appointed and agreed to next of kin giving informed and written consent.

Nobody should be able to pressure someone to have an abortion and nobody should be able to pressure someone to not have an abortion.

A medical decision about one's body is between them and their doctor.

If someone truly was interested in reducing abortion they would fight for parental leave for all, nationalized childcare, better access to nutrition for children, birth control and other contraception free and readily available and free bisalps and vasectomies for all who want them as well as proper sex ed.

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link

[–]THHBHStTWomen deserve the world [score hidden] 3 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

[–]THHBHStTWomen deserve the world [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

If a man had said half a shit about his fellow men you would have been calling him a simpy beta cuck faster than I could call her a - pick me

Humour me this, if she is genuine - Why does her videos only prop up men at the insult of women?

Why does she own her own buisness, unmarried, childfree? Why don't high value men pick her ass?

Why did she admit in a podcast interview that initially she would make videos on stock broker shit and because she did not get views she was trying out different topics to get viral and it was her video agreeing to Kevin Samuels that catapulted her amongst black manosphere so she decided to stick with it?

She says the only personal standards she has for her man is - conservative, family oriented and she would let him cheat on her....so why hasn't she found such a man? She is 25 looking 40 ? Isn't the wall ticking?

I don't give a f that you actually agree with pearl Davis views that is your own personal right, but even though you hold common views by t can't see her for the grift she is , is kind of sad man

[–]THHBHStTWomen deserve the world [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]THHBHStTWomen deserve the world [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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[–]Ylduts [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Ylduts [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]SoulBadguy0408 [score hidden] 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]AngeCruelleReturn of the insufferable virgin [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]bootyhunter69420 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Ok-Map-7596 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Andre27Purple Pill Man [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Ylduts [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Andre27Purple Pill Man [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]RocinanteCoffee1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–][deleted]1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]RocinanteCoffee1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Andre27Purple Pill Man [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Lift_and_LurkNo Pill [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon [score hidden] 3 years ago (27 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]CliffPR [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon [score hidden] 3 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Zestyclose_Truth9999early 20sF | partnered up | reality pilled [score hidden] 3 years ago (18 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]JollyRoger66689 [score hidden] 3 years ago* (11 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon [score hidden] 3 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

[–]Sad_Top1743Misogyny is not a joke Jim [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]JollyRoger66689 [score hidden] 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon [score hidden] 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]JollyRoger66689 [score hidden] 3 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]JollyRoger66689 [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]JollyRoger666891 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]JollyRoger666891 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]RocinanteCoffee1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]JollyRoger666891 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]RocinanteCoffee1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]JollyRoger666891 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]odd_cloud1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]LillthOfBabylon1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]EulenWatcherEgalitarian feminist [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Ylduts [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (17 children) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Zestyclose_Truth9999early 20sF | partnered up | reality pilled [score hidden] 3 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

[–]Ylduts [score hidden] 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

[–]Zestyclose_Truth9999early 20sF | partnered up | reality pilled [score hidden] 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]Ylduts [score hidden] 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]Zestyclose_Truth9999early 20sF | partnered up | reality pilled [score hidden] 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Ylduts [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]Zestyclose_Truth9999early 20sF | partnered up | reality pilled [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]Ylduts [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Zestyclose_Truth9999early 20sF | partnered up | reality pilled [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Ylduts1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Lost-Zebra6453 [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Lost-Zebra6453 [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]caobozo [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]caobozo [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Katatonicsnake [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (22 children) | Copy Link

[–]Lift_and_LurkNo Pill [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Lift_and_LurkNo Pill [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]LaloTwinsCaesar's Wife Must Be Above Suspicion [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]LaloTwinsCaesar's Wife Must Be Above Suspicion [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]RocinanteCoffee1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–][deleted]1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]RocinanteCoffee1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–][deleted]1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]RocinanteCoffee1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Lost-Zebra6453 [score hidden] 3 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

[–]Lost-Zebra6453 [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]Lost-Zebra64531 points 3 years ago [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]wtknightGen X Slacker[M] [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]caobozo [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]caobozo [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Katatonicsnake [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]relish5kLouise Perry Pilled [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago* (10 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted]0 points 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy3 points 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Ok-Map-7596 [score hidden] 3 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link

[–]According_Talk_3084 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]relish5kLouise Perry Pilled [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]THHBHStTWomen deserve the world [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Incel_Finder [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]Katatonicsnake [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]lehibu38 [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Katatonicsnake [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]AutomaticMeaning3844 [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Ok-Map-7596 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Creation_SoulMarried Purple Pill Man [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]chancetoliveMasculinity = Self Control [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]Creation_SoulMarried Purple Pill Man [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

there is a difference between wanting something in a "sane" way and wanting it regardless of how they do it or consequences.

So? Setting aside the random crazy, usually, people confuse the former with the latter.

I want a Mercedes (sane desire), but I am not willing to steal it (insane desire) or force Mercedes to give one to me for free because "reasons".

Right, and men aren't saying the analogous thing.

Also it becomes an obsession if it's all consuming and all other desires/wants become unimportant.

... and no one is doing that.

yes, you focus on the things that you want but don't have, rather than the things you want but also have. that way, you're trying to get more of what you want.
other desires/wants never become unimportant, they're just already met.

The answer is that you're misinterpreting men.

[–]Creation_SoulMarried Purple Pill Man [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

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[–]Andre27Purple Pill Man [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]Lost-Zebra6453 [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]januaryphilosopherWoman/student/UK/radfem/makes first move/healthy BMI/bi/taken [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Lost-Zebra6453 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]saraimarsenasimp pill 😘 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (52 children) | Copy Link

[–]Liftaboveall [score hidden] 3 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

[–]Liftaboveall [score hidden] 3 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]Liftaboveall [score hidden] 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]saraimarsenasimp pill 😘 [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]Liftaboveall [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]saraimarsenasimp pill 😘 [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]Liftaboveall [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]saraimarsena2 points 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]Incel_Finder [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Incel_Finder [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]relish5kLouise Perry Pilled [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Liftaboveall [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Zestyclose_Truth9999early 20sF | partnered up | reality pilled [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]King-SAMO1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]TooHornyToFapClinically Insane [score hidden] 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]Ok_Bear976Horse Pill [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]TooHornyToFapClinically Insane [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Not necessarily. Most abusers put on a facade. No abuser is going up to their victim at first sight and saying “I’m going to abuse you”. That’s not how that works.

I get what you’re trying to say though. There are lots of women who are willingly with men who possess negative personality characteristics but men shouldn’t want to be with those women anyways. Using the minority of men who are abusive in relationships as a reason for why you should be a shitty human being is pathetic and reminds me of a child throwing a tantrum. And I simply laugh at men with this mentality. If you don’t want to be a good person to simply add positivity in the world without reward, you deserve to be alone.

I also find it quite laughable that some men will preach “not all men” when it comes to majority of sexual assault, predatory behaviors, killings, and more being committed by men more than 90% of the time. But when a minority of relationships consist of abusive men, men use this as ammo for why all women choose bad guys and why they should be bad guys too. Let’s pick a narrative and stick with it.

[–]TooHornyToFapClinically Insane [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]King-SAMO1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]dysonRing [score hidden] 3 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link

[–]Katatonicsnake [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]dysonRing [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

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[–]dysonRing [score hidden] 3 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

[–]dysonRing [score hidden] 3 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago* (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]dysonRing [score hidden] 3 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]dysonRing [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]dysonRing1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]dysonRing1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]RIPGeorgeHarrison1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]WestCombSplitThe Holy Pill [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Katatonicsnake [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]WestCombSplitThe Holy Pill [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Katatonicsnake [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]Katatonicsnake [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]dysonRing [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]King-SAMO1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]HighlyFlashy1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]RocinanteCoffee1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]SeaSquirrelanti red pill, future top tier SAHD [score hidden] 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]THHBHStTWomen deserve the world [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Plus-Enthusiasm2987 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Ok_Bear976Horse Pill [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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[–]KingOfTheIncels_black pill man [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Stunning_Thing4208 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]MeanGuyNumber4 [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]BigVulvaEnergyWildling Beyond the Wall [score hidden] 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

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[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]dbz__f [score hidden] 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]divCal [score hidden] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

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I like it. Right now, if the Germans had not shut down their nuclear power plants, they would have a more resilient economy and energy security. It is so obvious that their politicians were bought by the Russians.

The problem with nuclear is that it comes with a lot of risk, and it requires precise risk management. Not all countries can have nuclear energy, but plenty of developed countries can. If you want to build and operate them, you require:
High capital investment upfront
Environmental stability (see Fukushima)
Protection from sabotage (terrorists and Wars)
Technological prowess (Nuclear power plants are no joke)
Robust Safety Engineering practices.

Most European countries are literally the best place for them (apart from Ukraine).

Energy security is extremely vital for all economies and is heavily correlated to inflation and quality of life. Well managed nuclear power plants are so much more reliable than most renewables. You can control supply with much more ease. The newer reactors are so much better and would have little to no downside ramifications even in places like Fukushima.

The problem with nuclear energy is fear. It is hard to explain what happened in Fukushima to a layman and so easy to mispresent the risks of nuclear energy.

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Well, if you replace internal combustion engines with the current electrical cars, you would need a lot of EV charging and a massive load on the grid. Countries with poor public transport would be worst affected. I cannot find the source I read but in U.S it could need 25 times the current grid. This source says it would require 12 times the current electrical energy for U.K: https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2023/01/26/electric-vehicle-charging-will-require-12-times-more-energy-than-used-today-warns-motorway-services-boss/?sh=22abf6146cf7.

I am not even sure whether large scale proliferation of batteries would be environmentally friendly, no one is talking about their disposal. I am also a bit skeptical whether production costs of electric vehicles is lower than traditional ICE vehicles.

[–]Maffioze1 point 3 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Well, if you replace internal combustion engines with the current electrical cars, you would need a lot of EV charging and a massive load on the grid. Countries with poor public transport would be worst affected. I cannot find the source I read but in U.S it could need 25 times the current grid. This source says it would require 12 times the current electrical energy for U.K: https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2023/01/26/electric-vehicle-charging-will-require-12-times-more-energy-than-used-today-warns-motorway-services-boss/?sh=22abf6146cf7.

Wouldn't that lead to a problem of energy shortage rather than a lack of storage? Not gonna lie this sounds impossible to fix to me. 25 times the current grid. We should just ditch the cars at large.

I am not even sure whether large scale proliferation of batteries would be environmentally friendly, no one is talking about their disposal. I am also a bit skeptical whether production costs of electric vehicles is lower than traditional ICE vehicles.

I think the minerals are pretty recyclable. What is very environmentally unfriendly is the mining of the minerals and their refining. It mostly happens in China.

As for the costs. They can get cheaper because of high efficiency in the manufacturing and economies of scale. But the components are more expensive.

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That is of course valid but wouldn't you say if your threshold to become interested in some is so ridiculously high that it becomes a detriment to your own mental health then there is an issue that should be looked at?

Can sometimes high standards be a symptom of a much more deeper issue because after all relationship wise things should theoretically be sustainable in the sense that the very vast majority of people can and are able to find people to connect with. Because psychologically the majority of people are more or less at the same wave lengths we aren't special so organically it's only natural to emotionally connect with someone of the opposite gender. But what if there is a physical obstacle? As in you don't find them attractive then of course going through with it regardless of both will be a bad idea for both of you. But why is it like that? Are women just naturally pre-disposed to only feel attracted to a small percentage of men? I don't think so. Maybe she's just so unlucky that it's definitely the case for her? Then that would be just unfortunate and she should hope to meet someone she is attracted it otherwise she's in a world of loneliness. But what if her base level of attraction was subtly pushed forward through years of gradual and unconscious change? Through fantasizing about a small majority of men, huge amounts of wealth, strict physical standards such as height and dick, and so on... Then doing some inner work is definitely something that would be healthy for her in the long run.

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The feeling of loving someone deeply and having that same person love you back deeply is literally and unironically the best feeling in the world. It's better than eating a delicious meal, its better than having sex, its better than watching a good movie or playing video games, its better than having a drink or the thrill of gambling. It's literally the most euphoric and ecstatic feeling in the world.

I dare say it is the best thing you can experience in your life as a human being.

And there's many MANY people missing out on this. Their sadness and anger is 100% justified. Society calls them incels or whatever. And feminists are like, they have no right to be sad at missing out on this vital life experience. They have to shut up and put up with the hand they are dealt.

It is a very important thing and if you miss out on it, you are 100% justified in being butthurt. It is, dare I say, a need and something every human should experience.

But they tell them they are evil for wanting this and for feeling miserable for not having this, and they are gaslit into denying their own hurt and sadness for fear of being labelled an entitled misogynist.

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Daily Community Chat Megathread

Comments

🎂🍨🎁

Title	Daily Community Chat Megathread
Author	AutoModerator
Upvotes	9
Comments	1423
Date	April 15, 2023 1:00 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/12mkh85/daily_community_chat_megathread/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/daily-community-chat-megathread.1214417 https://theredarchive.com/post/1214417