How do we "choose better partners"?

Creation_Soul · 2022-11-28T13:31:48+00:00

The problem (for both genders) is that:

they think with their genitals/hearts and ignore some red flags that become obvious in hindsight. fixing this is easier said than done
they work with imperfect information. My theory is that a lot of players wouldn't get as much sex if the women they were sleeping with knew she had basically 0% chance of a relationship. same with cheaters.

The problem is that nothing will guarantee 100% chance success.

Also, yes, you should always judge men by how they treat women who will NOT be having sex with them. That's who the whole "nice-guy" meme comes from.

Notanothrshitthrow · 2022-11-28T13:22:05+00:00

I'm lazy so just focusing on things to look out for:

1) If they seem like a "Fuckboy", they're most likely a Fuckboy. "If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck and swims like a duck, it's most likely a duck."

2) Don't date someone based on potential. If you're thinking anything like "I just need to fix a few things about them and then they'll be perfect", you're most likely going to be bitterly disappointed.

3) Be very wary of love bombing, manipulative behaviour, being quick to throw a tantrum etc.

4) Everyone has a few bad exes. However, if every ex of theirs seem to be "crazy" and they can't stop talking about it, then there very well could be an issue.

Grappleheart · 2022-11-28T13:44:49+00:00

The last point you made about how they treat women they aren't attracted to is really important. But here are my central points.

The way to choose better is to create a courtship process that eliminates men who are less likely to commit. Don't have sex too early, try to connect with him on a deeper level and push him to let you meet his friends and family. If a guy is willing to let you meet his friends or fam he is less likely to dog you out.

You need to take time to understand the man you want to be with. You need to hold off on the sex for as long as you can or at the very least not give it up too easy. You have to try to meet his friends and the people around him to get a better sense of who he is. Once you have an answer you can start to reward him more. This is a very labor intensive process though. And you need to do your due diligence. You have to also focus on destroying halo effects and trying to get to know the negatives of your partner as well.

Now this will never be a perfect process and there will be some that get away obviously but you need to learn your lessons and avoid future problems. You also need to learn from history. The fuck boy has existed for generations and you can easily sus them out if you hear enough descriptions. Usually an attractive person who has a lot of deep angst which allows most women to justify his poor behavior. I mean a sob story is the easiest way to avoid female radar these days. He will be persistent and make you believe that if you do not eventually have sex with him you will lose access to him forever which pushes you to want to go with him.

I would also suggest you read Robert Greenes "The art of Seduction". His descriptions of seducers can really help you get a deeper understanding.

Sea_Tour_3696 · 2022-11-28T13:34:01+00:00

When I was in the dating game as a guy I was extremely picky with any and all red flags. Now I did have the privilege of doing so during that time period because I was extremely in shape and making a decent wage.

I would talk to a few women at once. If I felt the chemistry wasn't there I'd let it be. If I talked to a girl and she never wanted to meet up or if she canceled I'd just drop her. No sense of wasting time. If I felt she wasn't looking for a guy like me I'd move on. If she was picky, rude, or was very opinionated I'd leave. If she only had interest in herself and nothing more I'd leave. If she expected me to pay for everything I'd leave. If she wasn't patient and forgiving I had to leave as I worked out of town a lot during that period and I needed someone to be willing to go through that with me. If we couldn't talk about topics without actually keeping things respectful I'd leave. If I had to wait very long periods of time between responses early on I couldn't be asked to continue to reply. If she was short in responses I wouldn't see any reason to talk to her. There's plenty more. Pretty much anything I saw that would lead to major conflict in an actual relationship I'd cut out of my life. You have to think about it this way when looking for someone to date. Can I put up with this long term and will this relationship lead to marriage/something serious or is it just fun for the time being. I didn't waste my time for anything short term.

Your discretion for red flags is entirely going to be on what you prefer in a partner. I wanted someone that was 50/50 with me. Equal standing. Someone I could talk to and feel safe with. Someone that I could love long term. Someone I knew for sure I could work things out with. This has lead me to a 2 year working on 3 year happy relationship. I'm always excited to see her and we never really fight. When we disagree it is awkward but we both can talk things out and make it better. Best advice is find someone that's willing to work things out and let things go. We all make mistakes in life, but if you can find someone to build you up and reciprocate that favor you will establish a good healthy relationship.

Some may not have the options to be so picky but generally do not settle for less. I'd rather be single than to deal with someone that was hateful and selfish. I learnt that with my first relationship. Be somewhat picky, but know when to compromise so you can be happy.

Good traits for a guy would probably be a care taker, hard worker, ability to communicate, non violent unless there's a threat to you or him, understanding, willingness to compromise with you, honesty, loyalty, willingness to take care of a family, good with kids or at least wanting kids (this means they are willing to take care of you and the potential offspring if you decide to have any), charisma, hygiene (if he cannot take care of himself he can't take care of you), goals or at least ambition for a better future, positive mindset (it sucks being around someone always complaining), good risk mitigation, and etc.

There's also the life skills. Laundry, dishes, cooking, ability and willingness to fix things. Etc

Now you'd be hard pressed to find someone that checks every box but this is generally the type of person I'd aspire to be and the person I'd think would be a good partner. Generally you want someone that will be forgiving and has the ability to communicate with you over anything. That prioritizes taking care of you (for example, I play video games sometimes around my girlfriend. Apparently some of her previous partners would get mad and yell if she talked to them when they were playing. That couldnt be me. Yes i love my video games like many men, but ill talk to her in the middle of a session. No 30 minute game is worth losing my relationship. Things like this could mean the difference between a happy and unhappy relationship).

You also have to be realistic with yourself and know what you provide in a relationship. Don't shoot for the stars if you're not a star yourself. You have to stay humble. Know your faults and be willing to work on them. I'd encourage anyone that knows they have massive flaws to work on themselves before seeking a relationship, but who knows you could always find someone even with flaws you just have to be willing to put in work and the same with them.You can find the piece to your puzzle. Someone that picks up where you fall apart.

InfamousBake1859 · 2022-11-28T18:09:28+00:00

Look at how he treats the women in his life.

does he love and respect his mother? Sister? Are they good models?
how does he treat the women he is not attracted to?
what was his prior relationships like? Did he call them all crazy bitches or did he logically identify reasons for the relationship to fail? Has he made wfforts to improve himself.
how does he treat children and animals?
hiw does he treat elderly?
basically how does he treat people who don’t offer him anything back - shows you the difference between a nice vs kind man.
does he do a good job putting you and your needs/wants before his own?
how does he deal with conflict?

KayRay1994 · 2022-11-28T14:20:23+00:00

As an early sign look at the way he treats others, watch for the kind of behavior he excuses, how he handles conflict, how he responds to you talking to other men (especially if its just platonically), pay attention to his social circle and pay attention to how he presents himself - these will tell you a lot about about a guy’s character, temperament and attachment style

BruddaMSK · 2022-11-28T14:49:21+00:00

Most of the time it all is obvious. Literally use common sense.

ratsareniceanimals · 2022-11-28T19:08:29+00:00

What traits do good men have?

Emotional intelligence. They can express feelings without losing control. They notice when someone in a group feels uncomfortable, and can find subtle ways to make them feel more welcome. They can sense when your anxiety is growing, and can intervene before it snowballs.

When I think of guys who women widely and truly adore and deeply admire (and aren't just attracted to/would sleep with) it's guys who are fluent in the language of feelings.

Snoo16680 · 2022-11-28T14:14:21+00:00

Honestly I have never been in a position to choose between different partners so my answers may be fully wrong.

These would be my advices:

be aware of what you are really looking for... plenty of women are thinking they want something but they just have no idea, a friend tried to find a relationship since a year, dated 25 great guys but didn't give any a second chance before realizing that she was very happy with a friend with benefits who ticked none of her boxes and with whom there is no future
communicate: a good man won't pretend to read your mind and to know better than you what you want. He is therefore less assertive.
don't take your wishes for reality/ don't be blindsided by attraction/love. It seems silly but in my experience as a man, many women don't read good clues when they are into someone (men do that as well).
if you are not someone feeling strong visual attraction to men, give more potentially good men a chance. I already saw a friend swiping on a dating app: she isually needs to spend time with someone to feel attraction.
observ the men you choose: how they behave with others, how they speak of others, how they speak of their ex...
if you want to find a respectful and good man, you cannot play game. He won't ask you out twice
a good man is probably not a very dominant man: he will probably ask for consent, he will probably take time if he isn't sure, he will respect you, he probably won't accept to hurt you even if you want to be hurt, he will treat you as an equal which means he can't be super dominant. In my experience, most women are not exactly looking for an equal, they want to be respected but don't want to take decisions or responsibilities.
you don't want to be with an asshole. So don't give assholes a second chance.
beware of the paradox of choices

Podlubnyi · 2022-11-28T17:48:28+00:00

Also, do you think we should judge men by how they treat women they think are unattractive? Could this be a tell tale sign of how he may treat you?

It's a good rule of thumb in general that you can tell a lot about a person by how they treat someone they don't have to be nice to.

Hungry-Adagio2152 · 2022-11-28T23:22:29+00:00

It’s not hard to exclude probably 75% of guys that aren’t going to be good partners with just a few basic criteria:

Success: does he have a job? Criminal record? Drug use history? Does he work hard? Does he have his own place/car, or does he just mooch off parents or past partners?
Attitude: does he approach a relationship from the standpoint of contributing something to it, or does he just see the situation as something to get as much out of for himself as possible? Does he treat service employees and his family well? Does he generally act like a jackass? (There’s a difference between healthy confidence and being a nonstop jerk, and women should learn the difference.) Does he actually seem to care about you?
Vibe: we know that lots of women are hopelessly attracted to “bad boys”, but honestly if a guy comes off with a strong “bad boy” or “fuckboy” vibe, that’s probably not a good prognostic sign for the rest of the relationship (regardless of his other traits)
Friends: this isn’t a perfect metric, but if everyone from your friends to your family to your co-workers is telling you that a guy is bad for you, you probably should listen to that. Likewise, if his friends are a motley crew of losers and fuckups, that’s not a good sign either.

These things aren’t hard to spot in the slightest. It has always amazed me that some women can’t see these things in various men, which are often glaringly obvious. (And the fact that some women reliably avoid these types of guys makes it obvious that it’s not a gender-wide blind spot.)

odd_cloud · 2022-11-28T16:08:40+00:00

So, if my sister asked me this question, I’d say a couple of things.

First, I’d say that many qualities which women like in men may have a negative side. For example, a confident guy may confidently fight you in the divorce court in the future trying to take your children and leave you with $5 of alimony a year. I’ve seen such cases.

Another example is masculinity. I know of a woman who preferred strong, tough type. Couple of these guys left her with a blue eye.

Same with being smooth. If a guy really like a woman very much, he’s going to be somewhat nervous and awkward. It’s easier to feel relaxed around women whom you are not that into.

So, my advice would be to distinguish between assertive and aggressive, confident and self-absorbed and so on.

John_Oakman · 2022-11-28T13:56:01+00:00

Hire a panel of trained feminists and FDS trained experts to vet every potential applicant.

2022-11-28T16:52:42+00:00

Good men are stable stoic men who are self aware with a good job. Unfortunately this is ultimately boring and does not give women that “spark” they’re always looking for. I think people need to stop thinking relationships are these miracles that just happen and not a choice you need to consciously make.

ExpensiveShoulder580 · 2022-11-28T13:27:04+00:00

Get a trusted male relative to vet him for you.

Blissey_Bless_Me · 2022-11-28T15:41:59+00:00

Looking for more than only his height and tattoo’s

JohnnyBravomark222 · 2022-11-28T14:29:13+00:00

watch how he treats other people

easily the most important way to vet

Podlubnyi · 2022-11-28T18:03:13+00:00

Don't date men you want to change. Accept him as he is or move on. People only change when they want to. A deadbeat who doesn't work and smokes weed all day probably isn't going to magically turn into father of the year when you have a few kids with him. Endlessly nagging him about it will just annoy him and then you'll be pissed because he isn't the man you wanted to turn him into.

Playful_Art_5364 · 2022-11-28T21:05:01+00:00

Don’t sleep with men you just met and don’t been know the middle name of. That should reduce the issue by 80%.

If you haven’t known him for atleast a year and don’t already know his friends you haven’t known him.

CLyD3_H3ffalump · 2022-11-28T14:37:16+00:00

This post seems redundant as no matter what a guy says, a woman's emotions are going to dictate who she chooses. If course she'd want a partner who is respectful, loyal, and attractive to her. The issue is they are absolutely fine overlooking the other two if the guy is gorgeous.

Digedag · 2022-11-28T13:51:34+00:00

So how would you vet a man if you were a woman?

Getting to know them, their friends and most importantly their set of values. Too bad that usually means you can't jump into bed with him at the 3rd date (or earlier).

NotARussianBot1984 · 2022-11-28T16:25:20+00:00

First step is to reduce hypergamous behaviors. Sleeping with men in similar fitness, economic, social circles.

Batting out of your league is easy as a woman temporarily.

2022-11-28T17:23:00+00:00

Alright, I'm only going to help a limited amount of people with this tip I have, but it will be very effective for those of whom it applies.

Just choose me.

Other men are inferior. You don't want them. They lie. They cheat. They steal. They're not not. You really can't trust them, and you never know what they'll do.

Me?

I will tell you from day 1 exactly how far I see this relationship going, and on my end, it'll stay pretty accurate! Sure, for lots of girls the answer is "your pussy is nice and we can be homies," but maybe that's not you! Maybe you're better than that.

And for the small price of your pussy, I offer custom-tailored advice to get you from where you are now, to locking down men you currently dream of at will. I am not kidding at all--my ex, who I did this for on accident tbh, went from like a 4 to a strong 8. Big mistakes were made because she left me, and no one should leave TheGirlGetter9000, but it speaks to my power.

So don't worry about vetting men. Just pick me. Problem solved.

CasperElshao · 2022-11-28T13:39:57+00:00

Be on the lookout for men who are attractive and kind but not arousing. Unfortunately these men are often really good men. It’s also the type of men who get played and cheated on the most.

shadowofdoubt13 · 2022-11-28T14:01:36+00:00

Look for a brutally honest man that will never lie to you no matter how much it hurts your feelings. With that foundation, you can go very very far

ArseOfValhalla · 2022-11-28T13:50:59+00:00

I think the main thing is to not ignore red flags you see. Obviously red flags are different for everyone so there is no proper way to answer that but when we see them, we should be more confident in just saying bye to that person. And obviously we should voice our boundaries more in the beginning and if they are ignored or whatever, then we shouldn't let them continue to push those boundaries. I think once we "found" someone willing to date us then as a whole we get too scared of being single and stay in that relationship anyway and then it gets too far to where we cant leave. And again, obviously this is a generalized answer and it doesn't fit everyone.

nicethingyoucanthave · 2022-11-28T16:55:46+00:00

but they never give advice on how to properly vet these people out.

Of course not! I'm a man. If you're trying to catch a man, you shouldn't ask a man. It's like asking a fish how to catch fish.

If you want to be successful at something, find someone who has already succeeded at it.

The only piece of advice I would give you is, a successful woman is not a 20 year old with a hot boyfriend. That's a trivial accomplishment. A successful woman is 40 years old in a ten year marriage (at least) with a high value man who is the father of her children, and who still loves and respects her husband and has frequent sex.

...and if you're about to reply to this comment and say, "but I don't want children" then lol okay, you're probably also not the type to ask how to find a good man. Most women are very unhappy when they follow the modern feminist "sex and the city" script. They're unhappy if they don't have children, and they're unhappy having to go to work every day.

They're unhappy for most of their lives, even though they greatly enjoyed their "hoe phase" - if you're going to reply to this comment and let me know that you're totes the exception then you're wasting everyone's time and giving bad advice to other women.

For most of your life, you're going to be old. If you want to be happy for most of your life, then seek out happy middle-aged women and learn from them. Don't take advice from unhappy women (FDS for example) or from the sex and the city crowd (who end up regretting it later).

It'd be dishonest of me to pretend to tell you how to achieve that, so I wont. Go learn from successful women.

NockerJoe · 2022-11-28T23:14:04+00:00

Watch for how he treats wait staff, janitors, store clerks, ect. Hoe he treats people he doesn't need to impress is how he treats you, eventually.

Fancy-Respect8729 · 2022-11-28T13:59:13+00:00

Went on a red pill women sub and it was basically a trad conservative attract high value (wealth) Man by being pretty and traditional forum. Non wanted to pay for their own meal.

So it's either that or raving feminists. What a time to be a Man.

Ok_Chicken3237 · 2022-11-28T14:31:18+00:00

If he seems like he’s love bombing you he is. I’m always so surprised when women get duped. Most men are so transparent in their intentions I’m like…huh so you though the guy who just got out of rehab and told you that you’re the love of his life in the first week was going to be your husband?

jackedsoon · 2022-11-28T16:07:04+00:00

Id wait to get some sort of commitment b4 sex. He has 1-2 ltrs atleast. No playing games. If he likes you, youd know. No such thing as a nonchalant guy, he just doesnt like you. Both parwnts married and see how he acts towards women in his family and strangers. Manners.

Its easy to ignore red flags if hes attractive and charming but trust ur gut feeling.

nothatyoucare · 2022-11-28T16:31:22+00:00

Take your friendzone and fuckzone and swap them.

Any-Bottle-4910 · 2022-11-28T13:58:26+00:00

Just watch “he’s just not that into you” and you’re good to go. Well, provided you don’t think you or your prospective partner are “the exception”.

Sorry, he’s isn’t the exception and you aren’t either.

AdditionalPrice7336 · 2022-11-28T18:02:19+00:00

YOU DONT THE UNIVERSE DOES, FREEWILL IS A JOKE, IT WAS ALEEADY HERE BEOFRE IT EVER WAS.

This choice thing...Is a trick of the mind, samsara and the ghost in the machine.

KingOfCarrotCake · 2022-11-28T13:19:50+00:00

Dont pick based on how pretty their face looks and how charismatic they are.

AidsVictim · 2022-11-28T23:10:21+00:00

I suspect most women already know what men make for better stable LTR partners. It's just a lot of them don't give a shit. The women fucking dudes that are radically different from their family backgrounds probably aren't going to work out. The hot guy who is always chatting with different women everytime he walks into a bar is probably not going to be loyal. The dude dropping everything to go on an epic random road trip isn't going to be the most financially stable. The dude who is always boasting and bullshitting isn't going to the most grounded. And so on.

Women have roughly equal IQ if not greater social IQ and can probably predict how most of these things turn out there's no real need to give advice. Despite all the rhetoric about how women want relationships more than men, for women that date these dudes (which is the majority of 20 something women) what they really want is the dopamine drip from "exciting" men or at least men that put them in "exciting" social situations. Everything else is secondary until they get old enough that it's all a bit socially embarrassing or there simply aren't enough exciting men available anymore.

Fusiontron · 2022-11-28T14:31:09+00:00

Talk to his friends, they will tell on him. Speak to other men about him. Do not just give your female friends a field report and then have them analyze it.

Barely-moral · 2022-11-28T15:28:09+00:00

So how would you vet a man if you were a woman? What red flags would you look for?

What traits do good men have?

First you need to know what you want from life. What kind of life you want to have in the next 10 years and the years after that. You need to know the circumstances you would like to have in your deathbed. The regrets you want to avoid, the memories you want to build so you can remember them when old and dying.

You want to know your priorities and keep them in order.

Only then you can know the traits you are looking for in a partner. Those traits are those that in their absence you wouldn't be able to build a life you find happy/content.

Picking a good partner means playing the long game.

How to vet?

Carefully and ruthlessly.

You are not vetting alone. You will need help from trusted people so they can look for potential partners and the traits in them. You may need to hire a private investigator to dig into someone's past. I recommend it.

A man without a past is not a good option. You need to know how he will react under different circumstances. The only way to know is to find someone that went through struggle and success.

If it is important for you that he knows how to travel through a specific hardship, find someone that went through it.

Also, you are not picking your partner. You are too close and too involved to trust in your own judgement. You pick a list of potential partners and someone you trust has the final say on who would be it. Preferably a man or multiple people one of them being a man. Women can be blinded by a man's lies or mask. Men are more likely to see through those.

abaxeron · 2022-11-28T16:40:15+00:00

but they never give advice on how to properly vet these people out

Not marrying and not getting knocked up by a literal violent felon would be a great start. It's not everything, but it's something. Second and third biggest red flags I'd consider are alcoholism and gambling.

Mr_Makak · 2022-11-28T16:48:11+00:00

Once someone shouts at you, loses control of their actions on drugs, threatens violence to anyone or assaults anyone, end the relationship and never contact them again.

Just applying this insanely simple rule would almost eliminate domestic violence if everyone did this.

UEMcGill · 2022-11-28T17:47:45+00:00

So many people talking about what to look for in the man, but missing the forest for the trees. Start with yourself. There's always two fucked up people in a shitty relationship and you can only unfuck one of them.

5eggsEveryday · 2022-11-28T22:41:52+00:00

I'll go against the flow. Choose partners that are arousing to you. Nothing is worse than a sexless relationship or when you feel obligated or pressured to have sex with a man. If you think that choosing "good guy" whom you can fall in love with later is a good decision then think again.

Other than that, men are not in a position to offer such advice. Only women know what partners they really want and they must live with their choices, mistakes or success. No rational argument will change female nature and what they are attracted to.

DryOutcome3407 · 2022-11-28T13:53:39+00:00

If you want a LTR choose a partner that will invest in a LTR. The party guy, good looking, charismatic with his life made have plenty of options why do you think he's not yet in a relationship? Because he's waiting for the one? Very unlikely. Every women end up with this sort of guy hoping he's going to change because she's special and he will magically change the behavior that bring no consequences, it don't happens.

Vet based on what you want, just don't complain about the results of the choices you've made. If I could have a night stand with a crazy women that ride me like a mechanical bull, I would but never in my life would consider it for a LTR and would never invest in the relationship thinking she will change.

Discussing redflags it's a pointless effort because what we men seen as a redflag is the same thing women find attractive. Take one of those romance books that sell a lot like 50shades and change the guy to being poor/ugly and you'll see the redflag. It's akin if men were attract to high-n women, on this metric unfortunately women ended up with the short end of the stick.

Good in what sense? LTR? Financialy responsible, mature, flexible, mentally stable and willing to lose weight. Just remember that you rarely can have all in one person, there's no Frankenstein BF.

If you're unattractive as well maybe, otherwise I don't know, seems to be counter productive because most men find women attractive to a degree what basically means the only one they find really unattractive are the bottom of the barrel that is already treated like shit by everyone else.

rantsincognito · 2022-11-28T21:39:01+00:00

The best way to get a good man is to be a good woman yourself. I know women want to pretend that they're all angels and if men just acted better we would live in an utopia, but that just isn't true. Like tends to attract like. A lot of the hand wringing women could do if they took less time asking "how do I find a good man" and ask "how do I become a good woman". The fact of the matter is that a lot of women out there don't even deserve good men because they would make them miserable. Most of the good women I know found good men. The ones who struggle usually deserve it. The bad women I know found partners, and they do usually suck too, but that just means they're a good match. No reason for a good man to be wasted on them, the end result would likely be her turning him into a bad man rather than him turning her into a good woman.

inb4 vIcTiM bLaMinG

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PuertoRock007 · 2022-11-28T14:22:54+00:00

I would say to choose based on character. For example many women today want a man with money but over look the guys when they are on their way up. If you wait to he gets there it might be too late.

I would also say that if you want to be treated well you have to be the pretty one in the relationship. So he can work hard to keep you.

Coolio_Street_Racer · 2022-11-28T14:31:49+00:00

Just wait until some commitment before having sex. This will weed out like 99% of people who are using you for sex.

mrgoodbarxxx · 2022-11-28T15:01:26+00:00

I don’t really consider myself a red piller (or any pill for that matter), but this is what I would tell any female friend looking to weed out guys:

Date with intention and let that be known up front.
Cut off your sneaky links. These are the guys you want to avoid anyway and goes with point 1. Avoid guys who still hangs with his sneaky links.
Date guys who are somewhat busy… with a career.
Look how the guy treats other people, especially women he is not sleeping with. Such as waitstaff.
Look for guys without roommates and his life pretty much together. After I got to a certain age, I didn’t want a roommate.
Someone who is driven. Has a history of success. Such as finishing college and maybe even a graduate degree. Or trade school/own business. Something tangible.
Healthy relationship with his parents.

Just a few. I could probably think of a few more.

baresquad · 2022-11-28T15:14:14+00:00

They say that to really mean give the guy that you usually wouldn’t a chance because there’s always the belief that guy you wouldn’t give a chance is your perfect match, even though he’ll probably be just as shitty as someone who treated you wrong before.

The real answer isn’t to pick better men, it’s to unapologetically know what you want and are looking for and to never settle for less than that.

OkProfessional9405 · 2022-11-28T16:09:57+00:00

I think you can use similar approaches to men. How do they treat people they don't want something from? What are their exes like.

There's obviously a considerable amount of tea leaf reading on this stuff. So just slow it from a straight drop to a parachute drop in while you observe.

Teacup000 · 2022-11-28T16:22:56+00:00

There's ton of posts on the r/redpillwomen sidebar. If you want advice geared towards women go to the RP women sub, not TRP.

carljungs · 2022-11-28T16:50:09+00:00

Be nice and look for someone nice, be a good woman, approach, and choose. Work on knowing yourself. You will waste a lot of time and emotions creating confusion dating random men. The men get more pointers because men are the economical slaves, work horses, and usually die first historically in wars future and past. Women tend to bond better with other group of women to get advise and open up. Be wise and not horney or desperate. Take your time to get to know the person.

CLyD3_H3ffalump · 2022-11-28T18:23:35+00:00

Really think it's just the men getting casual sex who don't have the self control to ignore the little head. What incentive do they have to do so? The men who don't get play as much as they think they deserve are (and if not really need to be lest they wanna fall into the "who hurt you" category women love to toss around) naturally apprehensive of who they partner with because they've already been made aware of the pecking order on who gets worry free nookie and who's getting fooled that they are. Please consider this: What sane man would blindly follow the lead of his little head in 2022? My answer: the ones who already know they're attractive enough to get casual sex no problem.

iamprosciutto · 2022-11-28T18:25:00+00:00

If I were a man-attracted woman, I would vet hard for personality.

I would only form a relationship with a man who

is considerate to those around him, kind to those he doesn't have to be kind to, generally honest, can stand up for himself (especially in difficult situations), and communicates his feelings, needs, and wants clearly. Those are all standards I hold myself as a man to in a relationship, so i would accept nothing less from my partner

AreOut · 2022-11-28T18:35:32+00:00

"Also, do you think we should judge men by how they treat women they think are unattractive? Could this be a tell tale sign of how he may treat you?"

I treat unattractive women like my male friends. If they don't like that I'm not courting them like I'm courting attractive girls they can always stop being friends with me.

PadThai42 · 2022-11-28T18:57:57+00:00

Communicate better and stop running when relationships get uncomfortable. Guys either shut down or scream and women tend to become passive.

InfluenceKlutzy7983 · 2022-11-28T19:36:27+00:00

lol, this isnt rocket science. Think deeply about what qualities are mandatory for a functioning LTR, and choose men based on that first, looks and everything need to come after that. the key is to choose on logic NOT ON FEELINGS.

TheRedPillRipper · 2022-11-28T20:05:42+00:00

What traits do good men have?

The first trait is a person's first impression. If a person doesn't put effort into grooming, from the jump, that speaks volumes.

Second self awareness. Then character/mindset. Especially against adversity. Nothing bring's forth a person's character, more than hardship, and their willingness to grow from it.

Finally communication. Relationships are fundamental to fulfilment. How a person communicates is pivotal to that.

Godspeed and good luck!

M3taBuster · 2022-11-28T20:14:51+00:00

Actually choose your partners instead of just waiting around for someone to ask you out, for one. I.e. approach men you are interested in, directly and explicitly.

The men most likely to approach you are the ones least inhibited by a concern for being respectful. So if you never ask men out and only go out with the ones that approach you, you are passively filtering for the most douchey, inconsiderate men out there. Whereas, if you approach men yourself, you might be able to tap into that subset of respectful, considerate men who never would've approached you otherwise. But there's still a chance that you approach the wrong guy, someone who might have approached you, but you just beat him to it. So to hedge against that, you should:

- Choose carefully about where you approach a man. Don't do it in environments that are generally understood to be places for casual encounters, like bars, clubs, and parties. Do it either in normal places that everyone goes to like malls, grocery stores, parks, etc. or places that would filter for men who share your hobbies, like the gym, a public sports arena, a game store, an art studio, etc.

- Make him wait. I recommend at least a year of formally dating. The idea is to make him wait long enough that he would lose patience and give up if he was only after sex. But don't make him wait longer than the shortest you've made another guy wait in the past, in order to be fair to him. Even if you don't care about being fair to him, it's risky to make him wait longer than you made other guys wait, because if he ever finds out, it'll blow up in your face .

- Pay attention to his family life, who his friends are, and who he surrounds himself with in general.

- If you're young, be willing to invest in a guy who doesn't have it all figured out yet. Rather than fixating on what he has now, vet for signs of good potential. Is he in school or working? Does he have a plan for what his next steps are to move up the ladder? Does he exhibit character traits like ambition, industriousness, responsibility, etc.? Is he competent at his skill? Does he show up to engagements on time, and is he good with time management? If you find a guy with good potential early on in his trajectory and are there for him when he needs you, it will pay dividends when he succeeds later on because he will be grateful to you and form a close bond with you, assuming that he has good character, which you should also be vetting for anyway.

PMmeareasontolive · 2022-11-28T21:40:30+00:00

Can you not tell when a person is a nice person? It's basically the same question.

the_butter_lord · 2022-11-28T21:54:26+00:00

How do we "choose better partners"?

This is usually said in response to women complaining about men they're seeing being disagreeable and/or being unwilling to commit. "Choose better partners" means "select for men who are more agreeable and/or more willing to commit".

Unfortunately these men also tend to be less desirable.

Waratah888 · 2022-11-28T22:04:48+00:00

Consult your family elders, particularly male elders. If you have a good relationship with dad, grandad, uncles, close neighbours ( basically anyone with some grey in their hair who cares about you).

Apply logic and emotion equally. Looking for your heart, head and 'lust' organs to align.

Prioritise behaviour, character, dependability over hotness, game, and sex.

Don't make excuses for his bad behaviour. If its an orange flag, query it. If it's a red flag walk away.

Play wotif games in your head, if he was treating your sister this way, what would I recommend she do. Then do that.

Take your time. Between 3 to 5 years to see someone in good times and bad. How did he react to losing his job? To one of your relatives passing away? To a political argument? To temptation by another girl? To seeing another man flirt with you?

DisasterPeace7 · 2022-11-28T22:05:41+00:00

Be honest with yourself about what you really want , who you are and what you actually offer
Try your best to be the woman that the man of your dreams would actually want
Use your father and or brothers to help vet if you can

Hungry-Nebula · 2022-11-28T22:21:20+00:00

Choose me, not other people. That's really the only advice I can give.

Philip8000 · 2022-11-28T22:32:56+00:00

Not RP, but I'll answer anyway. There's no way to absolutely, 100% avoid a toxic partner. Some can be very good at concealing his true nature.

If he's someone who spends his spare time drinking, doing drugs, or has multiple felony convictions, stay the hell away from him. This might sound obvious, but I've seen it play out too many times: thinking he's a good guy deep down, just rough around the edges. Or she can change him through the power of her love. Nope. Best-case scenario, you'll be used for sex and forgotten. Worst-case... my Dad worked in the justice system and saw this again and again; a few of the women ended up dead.

Smaller but still important: if in all of his past relationships, his ex is a horrible, evil monster, odds are good he played a bigger role than he's admitting. Most people are going to end up with some sort of toxic ex, but if it's everyone, you're likely to end up on that list in the future. Goes for men as well.

This is more for when you're in an established relationship, but men aren't mind readers. Sometimes, we aren't going to get hints or know instinctively that you want us to do something. I've read some female-oriented magazines and it's commonly brought up. "You should know without me having to ask." Well, sometimes we don't.

lolthankstinder · 2022-11-28T22:35:24+00:00

I think women are able to choose a good partner just fine. The issue is actually who they let enter the competition in the first place.

Inundated with options, many women turn to shallow physical attractiveness as a baseline filter. However, then they feel like they keep meeting emotionally unavailable, avoidant, toxic, or casual-only men. What’s going on? Well, it’s because they’re going through the “garbage” of the really physically attractive guys.

I’d recommend that women add a simple “bypass” rule for a guy that just seems “average” (not ugly): if they share a hobby/passion/interest with you, give them a chance! Also, research shows that a lot of times the date will go exactly how you think it will go. So, come up with a “pre-date” ritual to open your mind and rid yourself of potential bias.

RealAmericanWeasel · 2022-11-28T23:43:25+00:00

Stupid question. Ask them questions.

CLyD3_H3ffalump · 2022-11-28T23:52:11+00:00

Tell him he's being a real pussy about it; obvi a lot more sensitive than that but you get it. I mean, you're the one bleeding, and by your admission you're not asking him to work in that area anyways. Hell, make it fun and show him that F.R.I.E.N.D.S. episode with the 7 erogenous zones of a woman. In any case, I don't know how old y'all are, and I'm hoping it's on the young side cause in that case this can just be a case of your bf being so sadly naive in this matter. If he needs another reassurance, anecdote from a guy, one of my exes was practically insatiable during her time of the month; you don't look a gift horse in the mouth.

Snoo16680 · 2022-11-28T23:54:43+00:00

Age old, hard problem. Let me just give me two cents.

What do you want in a man? There is tons of ways men can be good. I think part of that TRP advice is a female version of "don't be shallow". Boring qualities are qualities too, and it is a good thing to think well of them.

With OLD: you will get matches with dudes that want sex, and only sex*. Those guys are noise to be vetted out, but remember that once all the noise is gone, you have the real number of interested men left. If that number is 0, then you are setting your sights too high. That is not the noise-men's fault, they just fuck up your empty list of matches.

Very polished OLD profiles yell "I love this game".. No effort yells "no effort".. I'd avoid both extremes.

Oh, and after the vetting is done, the end game is to find someone to love. It is possible to vet so much that you end up only seeing flaws, dislike and "business". I doubt that attracts the right kind of "candidate".

*The guy version of this is a list of not-so-subtle "I really need money, a green card, a father to my kids".

gozzff · 2022-11-29T00:10:06+00:00

The whole "nice guy" thing is just incel cope. You know what you're looking for in a man. It is genetically instilled into you. It's a way for low T males to discourage women from following their biological inclinations and choose a beta provider (paypig) instead of an actually attractive male.

No_Reflection_798 · 2022-11-29T00:52:02+00:00

Last question first. Yes. You should certainly judge *all* people by how they treat *all* other people.

As for the main point of the post, as everyone has already probably been telling you, check your friends list. Guaranteed that there is a good guy there. Not *all* will be, but there will be at least one. Guaranteed.

That's what you proactively do. What you proactively *don't* do is chase the butterflies.

You've probably also heard this a lot, but real and genuine relationships are not like in Disney movies or romantic comedies. Tell me what happened in Cinderella the week after the movie ended, and which of the actions that men take in romantic comedies won't get them arrested - or at least labelled as a creep.

What you are looking for is someone who you both would be at ease hanging out in your pajamas together. Poking fun at each other, and then lifting each other up in the very same sentence. Grinding through work schedules and life and priority changes. Those will happen.

Segue: I often see women say stuff in their dating profiles along the lines of, "I'm just as comfortable in a little black dress as I am in jeans". Okay, that's nice. But, what about the times when you want to be in a little black dress, but he's in more of a jeans mood?

That will cause fights. Plural. Look for a man who would be willing (and which you also would be willing) to navigate that difference with.

That's not "Chad". Guaranteed.

domdomdom333 · 2022-11-29T00:52:15+00:00

Looking at toxic relationships from the outside, I'd say primarily the thing to watch out for is the guy trying to isolate you and the things you want to do, like trying to pull you away from family/friends.

If they get easily agitated into doing something they didn't want to do. Not being able to say no. Like if someone says jump head first into the lake at a party, they say no, someone calls them a pussy and they change their mind cause they don't want to be seen as a "pussy." Fragile masculinity behaviour.

You're the life's goal/he has no goals. I strongly believe in that men should strive for a certain goal they invision, and women are merely a partner for the accompanying journey. Guys who have no goals and see being in a relationship as the prizes of living will inevitably let go of themselves and move on. Including little things like sex life. Aren't you the prize? Why should he try to please you? It's him who's "won."

wtknight · 2022-11-29T01:09:35+00:00

People in general pick better partners by being less shallow and choosing based more upon personality and less upon looks (although looks are always going to be somewhat important, of course).

Men often pick poor relationship partners, too, so it's not just something that women do.

2022-11-29T02:23:19+00:00

Start by letting a man in your family vet them. A brother or father is best. Male friends won’t work, because they might disqualify other men because they secretly want to sleep with you.

If you don’t have a father or brother, start by having consistent standards for a dating process before you sleep with a man. I’m not saying sleep with each man after the same number of dates, but have a consistent minimum requirement. Lots of women will sleep with some men very quickly if it’s “just sex”, but make potential husband material wait. Shooting yourselves in the foot there, because a man with self respect will walk away before that period is over IF you aren’t consistent. For example, if you held a standard to every man, and a guy walked away, he’s not worth your time anyway. However, if you deem him husband potential it is likely because of his behavior, not appearance. This takes work and deserves respect. If you sleep with men who don’t earn that respect through actions, it is disrespectful to the man who is earning your respect. It’s not that he “thinks he deserves sex” but that you clearly aren’t a virgin, aren’t saving yourself for marriage, and aren’t abstinent. It shows that you are willing to have sex, just not with him. He might wait for years for you to be ready, but not if you are giving it away for free to someone else while keeping him as a side option.

For the rest of the time, men are pretty straightforward. Ask them if they want a relationship or just want to fuck. Ask them what their career goals are. Usually women date enough to experience one toxic man in their youth, I would say just don’t keep repeating it intentionally. Excessive tattoos, fast/loud cars, obsessed with seeming “alpha”, etc… pretend you are in the 1950s, being courted. A man should protect you and provide for you without using controlling you other than stating what behaviors would be deal breakers for the relationship.

RunsWlthScissors · 2022-11-29T06:48:09+00:00

I don’t think this complicated question needs to be as hard as we make it.

Someone who meets your standards simply. Send the rest back to app land. We develop them over time, so if you can’t nail down your own yet think about what you have learned through your dating experience or go date.

Red flags are a bs term. There are things you can and can’t look past, no need to sugar coat it. Gotta see people as they are and decide at points whether you keep going or not. No right or wrong answers here like before outside the obvious no’s.

The only traits I really recommend are confidence in self from self and room for empathy and consideration. Have never seen anything good come from ships that lack those on either side.

Yes, we judge people by actions, all their actions. Only thing differing is interpretation from who’s judging.

Learn from experiences and do you lady

YetAnotherCommenter · 2022-11-29T11:01:27+00:00

Short answer - you really can't.

The blunt reality is mimicry is real, effective and not only that but in the SMV it is easier to sustain mimicry than it is in the RMV.

What I will say is that the "creep detector" is really just a loser/'sperg detector, not a signal of danger. The "creep detector" didn't save Ted Bundy's victims.

Also, IF I am right that mimicry is harder in the RMV than the SMV, you may need to avoid the SMV and stick with the RMV in order to improve the effectiveness of any vetting process.

But this is relationships between humans. Both sexes engage in mimicry and try to present their "best selves" to and conceal their flaws from potential mates. Perfect vetting would eliminate mimicry. There is no perfect vetting.

So how would you vet a man if you were a woman? What red flags would you look for?

The only thing I can say is "cluster B personality disorders." But these can easily be concealed in an SMV situation.

What traits do good men have?

All the answers you will get to this question will be self-interested answers. They'll be tainted by bias and thus unreliable.

Also, do you think we should judge men by how they treat women they think are unattractive? Could this be a tell tale sign of how he may treat you?

For one, men whom are interested in you likely do not think you are unattractive, so it wouldn't be a good sign of how they may treat you in the future (unless you plan to 'let go of yourself' after securing commitment).

Why not gauge men on how they treat their fellow men (including the "loser" or unattractive men)? That might show you just how awful and cruel they could potentially be (although not necessarily to you, since, well, chivalry etc).

Warm_Gur8832 · 2022-11-29T13:09:42+00:00

I think women would do the human race a lot of good by simply pairing up with softer dudes when possible, in the grand scheme of things.

Especially over a few generations.

Instead of the guys that pride themselves on their ability to fist fight with grizzly bears.

HODL_monk · 2022-11-29T17:23:25+00:00

Unfortunately, there are a few men that are good at seduction, and a lot of us that have no clue, so there is not a lot of advice the majority of men can give on this topic. I doubt I could tell if someone would be a bad partner, until after the fact, and that would be if I knew the man. A lot of men I know just want casual sex, so that is definitely something that is out there. In the end, all of this is subjective. As a society, we seem to be moving away from commitment, for various reasons, and unless more women hold out for commitment, its unlikely to change.

themayorofhoodville · 2022-11-29T18:03:51+00:00

The answer to this is honestly somewhat simple, in theory.

My one and only thing that I would say to women is that those non-negotiables that you put in place towards dudes you’re only feeling “meh” about, need to start applying to those who you feel yourself wanting to hop in bed with right away.

lolmastr13 · 2022-11-29T18:19:34+00:00

Go out more/meet more men and talk with people who interest you. Big 🚩 is when they’re only pretending to be interested in you apart for for your body. It’s really hard for women to know if a man they don’t know is lying or not so this is where having friends opinions is good. Best way to know independently is to talk to the men about stuff like hobbies,family,movies, etc and extrapolate from that what they really like.

lolmastr13 · 2022-11-29T18:43:12+00:00

Judging a man by how he treats unattractive women is fine but be careful not to expect them to treat them like a woman would.

HighestTierMaslow · 2022-11-29T19:28:34+00:00

Yes, you should judge men by that because it shows they character.

-How he treats those he needs nothing from. How he treats service staff or wait staff or those in need/vulnerable.

-How he treats his sister, mother, aunts.

-Does he remember little things in conversation you have told him about what you like.

-you pick up on double standards over time (a common one I see with men is they expect you to be emotionally supportive when they have a hard time but dont return the favor for you)

-oogles other women or is too flirtacious

-How he speaks about his friends. If he tries to be a good friend to them. When I was younger I was surprised to learn men can be fake catty friends too to their own male friends. Big red flag.

-Watching excessive porn

-Following a lot of insta models/porn stars on social media or going to strip clubs

-Does he schedule things with you at the last minute frequently

-Always on dating apps/not deleting them even while being exclusive with a partner

-Excessive video games, gambling, fantasy football, clubbing, working out and/or sports watching.

-How he reacts when he doesnt get his way

-How willing is he to compromise

-Watches too much reality TV

-How he talks to when during fights/how he resolves conflict

-Smoking, drugs

-his parents dynamic is one where his father is mean, selfish, misogynistic and his mother is an angel. He will expect to recreate that dynamic. I find people with parents like this become them or hate them. If he does hate them, does he expect you to take on ill treatment of his family. Does he stick up for you? If he hates his family, has he emotionally worked through it?

-being a fan of misogynistic figures such as Jordan Paterson, Elon Musk, Joe Rogan, and Ben Shapiro

-sexualizes everything or makes constant sex related jokes

-does not support abortions or respect women being pro choice

-has misogynistic friends. You are who you surround yourself with one-hundred percent

- sexual behaviors that indicate his aim is to recreate porn scenes with you (which is a giant walking red flag)

ALSO this applies to both genders

Plopolok · 2022-11-29T21:52:56+00:00

It's a vast question, but I'll give a short answer: men who would be good fathers. (Not necessarily rich, nowadays it doesn't take much to raise and educate healthy children). (And yes, I wish women would do this even for hookups with condoms. It's a philosophical stance, not a practical solution.)

How do we "choose better partners"?

Comments

Here's the part you made up out of whole cloth:

Title	How do we "choose better partners"?
Author	Jupitersjunky
Upvotes	73
Comments	291
Date	November 28, 2022 1:16 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/z6wbi8/how_do_we_choose_better_partners/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/how-do-we-choose-better-partners.1141537 https://theredarchive.com/post/1141537