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Blue Pill men: Would you be happy being the marriage material or someone she would have casual sex with?

Novel-Tip-7570 · 2024-08-11T05:22:27+00:00

https://x.com/HMBrough_/status/1821982517299441976 This reddit post has gone viral on Twitter/X. It's about a woman who told her boyfriend that she...

Novel-Tip-7570

August 11, 2024

110 upvotes

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Title	Blue Pill men: Would you be happy being the marriage material or someone she would have casual sex with?
Author	Novel-Tip-7570
Upvotes	110
Comments	457
Date	August 11, 2024 5:22 AM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1epd1yl/blue_pill_men_would_you_be_happy_being_the/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/blue-pill-men-would-you-be-happy-being-the.1526967 https://theredarchive.com/post/1526967

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Ofc this kind of honesty in a such context is extremely stupid and the fact that she does not realize it only proves that she is dumb herself.

On the other hand, I’ll play bit of a devil’s advocate here. Let’s be honest, millions of LTRs and marriages constitute of a man and a woman, where the woman would not give that guy one minute of her time just for casual sex. Not because she wouldn’t engage in such activities but because the guy is not attractive enough but he has resources and attitude to be a good catch for marriage/LTR. I think many men are really hard trying to supress this feeling and they constantly lie to themselves.

Actually I know men, who are very honest with themselves and they even publically confess that they are betabuxers. Because it’s so obvious that they don’t see a point in trying to deny it. It’s their personal decision and they chose this kind of life. I wouldn’t want to be in their shoes but don’t condemn them.

But it’s always funny when you have these couples with an unattractive guy and somewhat good looking chick and the guy tries to portray himself as some kind of an alpha womanizer when in reality everybody knows that it’s his wallet that did the seducing. I love when someone calls them out and when it’s the chick herself it’s the funniest scenario. Don’t blame someone for his trade-off decision, laugh at those who don’t admit it. That should be the rule.

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relationship is better than just having sex.

Sure, but if a woman wouldn't sleep with a guy unless he had certain resources or other things to sweeten the deal, that doesn't exactly scream attraction. Especially if she has been when men before based on attraction alone without them needing to barter resources and stability. Getting betabuxxed isn't the W women seem to think it is for the men they settled for.

"I don't think you are good enough for a relationship"

Not what he was saying. He was saying that a woman telling a man he's not good enough to sleep with without him offering resources and commitment is the equivalent to a man telling a woman she's not good enough for a relationship but good enough for sex only. Neither is a compliment. The only exception to this would be a woman who has always required commitment before sleeping with a man.

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to me that would basically be her saying "you're not attractive enough that i would ever do anything sexual with you purely for its own sake, this only works because there is a commitment and resource sharing involved."

For most women, she liked you enough for sex for its own sake and actually enjoyed the sex, it wouldn’t be casual for her. She wouldn’t want to throw you away at the end and wouldn’t think of you like throwaway trash because great sex is actually hard to find for a woman.

When you think of casual sex, you’re thinking like a man that basically anybody with a hole is roughly equivalent and all sex is good sex. Women are not men. For women, good pleasurable enjoyable sex is way less easy to come by and is way less worth the risk when it’s not really special. In most cases, if a woman is willing to be causal with you, it means your dick is “meh” at best, and she could take it or leave it.

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For most women, she liked you enough for sex for its own sake and actually enjoyed the sex, it wouldn’t be casual for her. She wouldn’t want to throw you away at the end and wouldn’t think of you like throwaway trash because great sex is actually hard to find for a woman.

What are you saying? Would you enter a relationship with somebody just because he is good in bed? Would you not have casual sex with men that you couldn't see yourself in a relationship with? I really dont understand.

she liked you enough for sex for its own sake and actually enjoyed the sex, it wouldn’t be casual for her.

You are literally saying "if the sex is good, it isnt casual.".

I think you might be getting confused what casual means. FWBs and fuck buddies are also considered casual, not just ONS.

So lets say you come across a man that is attractive and gives you "good, pleasurable, enjoyable sex", but he's other wise very boring or you are in different stages in life or you just have different goals and are incompatible. Why wouldn't you be casual with him?

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[–]badgersoniceWoman -cing the Stone [score hidden] 1 year ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Circle jerking behind my back, I see. But you’ve got it wrong.

I think casual sex is generally a negative for both sexes. It’s men and women both seeking out an extremely intimate physical but simultaneously avoiding intimacy as much as possible with that person… and spreading disease and unwanted babies. It’s two people who don’t support each other or care about each other trying to get pleasure from the other without supporting one another.

For men, specifically, the very existence of casual sex has somehow convinced a bunch of men that the very most meaningful and deep possible sexual connection they could ever have sexually is with a woman who does not love them and does not want him around at all, and that any woman who loves them and truly wants to spend time with him beyond just spreading her legs is just a bitch gold digger using them for cashhhhh.

Like how can that be healthy? Casual sex is rotting a lot of young men’s brains.

[–]badgersoniceWoman -cing the Stone [score hidden] 1 year ago (2 children) | Copy Link

What are you saying? Would you enter a relationship with somebody just because he is good in bed?

If you’re asking me personally, no, because I don’t and never have had casual sex. I would not have sex with a man I don’t like enough to want in a relationship in the first place.

As for other women, sex alone isn’t enough for a relationship, but it is an absolute minimum requirement. If it’s just casual sex, you’re just not good enough for her to want you around long term.

Would you not have casual sex with men that you couldn't see yourself in a relationship with? I really dont understand.

I would never have casual sex with a man I didn’t want a relationship, no. Some other women might.

You are literally saying "if the sex is good, it isnt casual.".

Not exactly, but that’s almost always incidentally the case for women. Women are way way less likely to orgasm from casual sex than from committed relationship sex. If she’s not orgasming, it’s very likely related to how casual the relationship is.

I won’t say it’s 100% this way, but it’s very likely that most women generally only have really amazing sex when the sex isn’t all that casual to her. I cannot say which way the causality goes— it could be that amazing sex makes her want it to not be casual anymore, or it could be that most women cannot experience amazing sex without a deeper more committed connection. It isn’t my place to say.

But what I can say pretty strongly is that if she’s keeping it casual, the odds are really really high that she’s not having the kind of mind-blowing amazing sex with you you praise yourself for giving. She’s probably faking orgasms and using you as a place-holder or boredom game while looking for someone she likes a whole lot more.

FWBs and fuck buddies are also considered casual, not just ONS.

A FWB is literally a long standing connected friendship relationship, just one where you don’t want dedicated commitment. But it’s not “I just fuck you regularly and otherwise don’t give a shit about you and have zero emotional connection to you”. Anyone you could just leave at the drop of a hat isn’t that important to you.

Why wouldn't you be casual with him?

It is not possible for me to desire sex with the boring man you describe, let alone enjoy the sex. Why on earth would I ever fuck this boring man I have no connection to?

You, like lots of men, seem to believe the absolute pinnacle of sex for women is having casual sex because to you, as a man, it sounds like the awesomest thing in the world to have a harem of women willing to have sex without even wanting to spend time with you. You view spending time with the woman to be a miserable chore you want to avoid. And likewise some men, at least, will give themselves an ego boost if a woman is willing to spread her legs and risk pregnancy for him while he gives her nothing, not even an orgasm, in return.

But women are not men. Women did not evolve to find “casual” sex to be the most amazing achievement. For women, sex is a lot riskier, and there’s no positive validation from it. Men often feel like they’re an amazing dude if they manage to win over lots of women for sex… but what’s the validation women get for winning lots of men over? That’s nothing more than the acknowledgment that she appears to be a living breathing female, since apparently men are desperate. So for women, there’s not a lot of ego boost, much higher risks (pregnancy, violence), and low chance of reward.

So yeah, most women don’t view getting a man for casual sex as some kind of major meaningful achievement, and they don’t see it that way for the man either.

[–]4jayc4 [score hidden] 1 year ago (1 child) | Copy Link

If you’re asking me personally, no, because I don’t and never have had casual sex.

But what I can say pretty strongly is that if she’s keeping it casual, the odds are really really high that she’s not having the kind of mind-blowing amazing sex with you you praise yourself for giving.

How would you know if you've never had casual sex? It's not that you take experiences that you've had and project them on other women, it's that you take experiences you didn't have, and project them on other women. Crazy. What evidence do you have for the statements you've made? And please no anecdotes or "all my girlfriends..."

So I feel like I'm getting why you see no problem with the telling your partner "I wouldn't want you as a casual sex partner". You (a person that has never had casual sex) believes that "if she keeps it casual, the sex can't be good", ignoring that he might keep it casual, that they just aren't compatible enough for a committed relationship or that a relationship between two people that is solely based on sex might involve good sex.

You have no evidence for your claim "if she keeps it casual, the sex can't be good". I also have none for mine. There's no study I can link you or anything.

But i feel like if you think about it logically: Why would women agree to repeadtly see a man just for sex, if the sex isnt even good?

I know plenty of ugly, unattractive dudes that are married. And why wouldn't they be? They provide for their family, they're good fathers, they're mature, they communicate, they're kind and emotionally stable. There's plenty of good traits they have, that make them a good partner. I feel like if you're a woman that is mid-thirties, has had her fun and wants to start a family, these traits are much more important than mindblowing sex. So i suspect if women want so start a family and they see a guy that is "husband material", a man that has all these traits that are important for a marriage to work, but the sex is only ok, most women would be willing to compromise.

But if a relationship is solely based on sex (i.e. fuck buddies), like sex is literally the only component, then there's no reason to compromise on the sex. Why would women have sex with a man, if they dont even enjoy it or orgasm like you said in your paragraph here?

And likewise some men, at least, will give themselves an ego boost if a woman is willing to spread her legs and risk pregnancy for him while he gives her nothing, not even an orgasm, in return.

I mean, for god's sake, I, a man (desperate, according to you), would rather masturbate than have bad sex. Why would women (less desperate, according to you) think different, when they don't even enjoy the sex and get no reward?

That’s nothing more than the acknowledgment that she appears to be a living breathing female, since apparently men are desperate.

When you think of casual sex, you’re thinking like a man that basically anybody with a hole is roughly equivalent and all sex is good sex.

Also, You completely contradict yourself here:

Women are not men. For women, good pleasurable enjoyable sex is way less easy to come by and is way less worth the risk when it’s not really special.

So you're saying sex for women isn't worth the risk when it isn't special? Well then... why would a woman have repeated casual sex with a man if the sex isn't good, like you state here:

But what I can say pretty strongly is that if she’s keeping it casual, the odds are really really high that she’s not having the kind of mind-blowing amazing sex.

[–]badgersoniceWoman -cing the Stone [score hidden] 1 year ago (0 children) | Copy Link

How would you know if you've never had casual sex?

I listen and observe. You also are not a woman who has ever had casual sex, so why do you think you are not projecting your own feelings?

What evidence do you have for the statements you've made?

You are not a woman who has had casual sex. What is it you called me for talking about people when I am not one of them myself, “crazy”? Right back at you, dude. What evidence do you have for statements you’ve made? And please no anecdotes or "all my girlfriends..."

You have no evidence for your claim "if she keeps it casual, the sex can't be good".

The evidence I have is that women are a lot more likely to orgasm from sex in a relationship, and are way less likely to orgasm from casual sex. There’s studies for this.

Like I said already: I cannot state the directional causality here. But the general rule is if it’s casual, it’s statistically not the best sex she’s had by a long shot.

I'm getting why you see no problem with the telling your partner "I wouldn't want you as a casual sex partner".

If I told them that, it would be because they’re not important in my life, and what they provide is something I could take or leave.

But i feel like if you think about it logically: Why would women agree to repeadtly see a man just for sex, if the sex isnt even good?

In that case, because she thinks it’s maybe a little better than her hand, but she doesn’t like him or the sex enough to want to spend any time or effort on cultivating it into a more sexually rewarding relationship. Remember again: relationship sex is doubly likely to give a woman an orgasm over casual sex.

So you're saying sex for women isn't worth the risk when it isn't special? Well then... why would a woman have repeated casual sex with a man if the sex isn't good, like you state here:

If It’s just mediocre and better than nothing to her, but not mind-blowing and worth any effort to keep, she might stick with it because its low effort while she’s looking for something a lot better. Also because some women have higher risk tolerance. Also some are drunk or high. Or have terrible self-esteem and think some unenjoyable dry sex is the only way anyone will tolerate her, even if she doesn’t like him a lot.

There’s a lot of reasons women do casual sex. It’s men who are motivated to tell themselves that every time a woman has sex it means the guy is some kind of sex god.

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I'd argue the opposite, but from an evolutionary lens, due to the dimorphism in human sexual attraction. We too often forget that the biology we've evolved is so much older than birth control.

So, in a casual encounter, the only thing she has to go off of is physical appearance, but the primary driver for female sexual selection has always been incumbent on the ability of a given male to provide, both materially and socially. Seeing a man who is tall, fit, and who speaks confidently, are all proxies for this ability, so it makes sense why they would find the physical characteristics of a man to be attractive.

But, there's many ways to be a competent provider, and the correlation of those characteristics doesn't mean much once larger societies begin coming around. While in a tribe, those traits correlate so tightly to being a good provider, that the attraction became inbuilt, but as soon as you have society, it all changes.

Now there are ways for not so tall, not so fit, and not so confident men to excell in those domains, and there's no way for a woman to see that until they've gotten to know them. So, in a casual encounter, where they have nothing else to go on, they wouldn't fuck the short, chubby dude, with no game. But, after getting to know him, she would, and commit to only being with that guy.

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[–]No-Rough-7390Red Pill Man 19 points20 points21 points 1 year ago* (19 children) | Copy Link

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[–]No-Rough-7390Red Pill Man 19 points20 points21 points 1 year ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[+]RayRayGDPink Pill Woman -9 points-8 points-7 points 1 year ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]No-Rough-7390Red Pill Man 13 points14 points15 points 1 year ago (6 children) | Copy Link

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[–]FrameWorried8852 7 points8 points9 points 1 year ago (5 children) | Copy Link

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[–]Proper_Frosting_6693Red Pill Man 22 points23 points24 points 1 year ago (60 children) | Copy Link

[–]Doo__DahBlue Pill Woman 5 points6 points7 points 1 year ago (49 children) | Copy Link

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The guy is getting sex either way. If for whatever reason he isn't someone the woman sees as compatible long-term, then she'll view him as someone just to have casual fun with and he gets sex. If he's someone she REALLY likes on a deeper level, she'll view him as someone she wants a relationship with and he gets sex if he also wants to pursue a relationship.

Generally people won't want to enter into a casual setup with someone in the second category because of the significant likelihood of getting hurt when feelings inevitably develop. The types of men women feel safe agreeing to casual relationships with are the ones they feel fairly confident they're not going to fall for.

Being in a serious relationship is a big responsibility and commitment for either party. Most husbands, in reality, are not routinely having to save their wives from a boat capsizing. Both parties, however, have to make a lot of compromises and sacrifices and put a work into the relationship - a serious relationship isn't any less of a responsibility for a woman.

[–]West_Collar_9960 [score hidden] 1 year ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]shadowrangerfsPurple Pill Man 17 points18 points19 points 1 year ago (34 children) | Copy Link

[–]Doo__DahBlue Pill Woman 7 points8 points9 points 1 year ago* (33 children) | Copy Link

Sure there's that argument around "other men get sex for free but I have to take her on dates??!". Which I can't really be bothered to think about very much tbh - I've always slept with men fairly quickly if I really like them, but I've also made it clear that I want to be exclusive and am not up for a FWB situation with the ones I was REALLY into. And all my relationships have been quite equal in terms of paying for or planning activities, so in terms of 'what they have to do to get it' it's largely just been to exist as someone that I feel a spark with.

Lots of women are similar to me, lots of women aren't, it's a pointless argument because both men and women have wildly varied and individual expectations around early dating and when to sleep with someone, which might be different depending on how they feel about each specific person, and you can't really make a generalisation around it. So it's a pointless one to complain about - "some people do a thing and I don't like it". Cool, don't date them then.

But that's not really what the post is about anyway. It's her saying that she didn't see him as someone she'd just want to hook up with without commitment when they met. And I still fail to see what's insulting about that.

[–]shadowrangerfsPurple Pill Man 15 points16 points17 points 1 year ago (4 children) | Copy Link

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[–]Proper_Frosting_6693Red Pill Man 8 points9 points10 points 1 year ago (3 children) | Copy Link

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It’s understandable to want to keep your lifestyle. However, I think there are many women you could still be compatible with. Believe it or not there are successful relationships that are long distance or one or the partners is in the military or completing an internship or have to move away. Working long hours isn’t always a dealbreaker.

I work about 55 hour weeks on average and it’s hard. I always want my space when I get home and im hungry, my boss is like the ultimate bitch, and I have a weird coworker with no social awareness.

But we make it work. You communicate ALOT and you set boundaries and compromise on things that don’t ask too much of either person. Lots of the time, I bring dinner home and clean to keep myself busy from thinking of work. He gives me space and eventually massages. We always eat together. Little bit of sexy time if we’re not too tired and rest and repeat. We also have separate things we like to do. He hates shopping so I go alone and he prefers alone time with long drives and going out into nature. Sometimes I’ll join him if it’s a place with less bugs LOL.

Relationships are a lot of work and sometimes make you crazy but in my experience, it’s worth it for the right person.

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Okay, been a lurker for a while and this post finally prompted me to make an account, so I'll try throwing my two cents in.

What you have to understand is that generally, as a woman, receiving sexual attention from men doesn't seem inherently special because "men only want one thing". A man being sexually attracted to you isn't a big deal/doesn't say anything in particular about his overall feelings for you. What is a big deal is a man being emotionally and relationally invested in you (using you in the general sense here).

But (again, generally speaking) to a man, receiving sexual attention from women is more of a rarity. It is easier to create emotional/relational investment, even if it may not be romantic. This is partially what leads to things like the friend-zone and comments like "why are you single, you're such a great guy", "sorry, you just give me more of a friend vibe than a bf", or "I hope I can find someone like you one day". Even though they have the emotional connection with these people, they as men do not arouse the sexual attraction to lead to a romantic relationship, so in a romantic relationship being told you are relationally attractive, but not sexually attractive is just a relegation back to that same place, except now it's coming from the person you thought, or at least hoped did have sexual attraction towards you.

And as far as if that's what she said, I'll break down my perspective on her words:

"he is not someone I would hookup or fwb with" = he's not not independently sexually attractive

"but marry" = makes up for his lack of sexual desirability in other areas (being a good life partner, wealthy, seems like they'd be a good parent, etc.)

You seem to perceive this as "I would not waste you on a casual relationship" but that is not how what she said comes off, especially since she didn't use the word "just" the way you've been stating it. If she'd said "you're not someone I would just hookup with" it would imply she'd hookup with him, which implies that he is sexually attractive to her, independent of anything else he can offer in a relationship.

If you really want to try and understand it, watch this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4aMiAesXjE

She basically said you don't arouse enough lust within me for me to want to act on it but you are good enough to me that I would enter a relationship with you and tolerate the sex.

You may be different and that's fine, but this is how I believe her statement would generally be understood by men.

[–]addings0 1 point2 points3 points 1 year ago (6 children) | Copy Link

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[–]sad_asian_noodlePurple Pill Woman 1 point2 points3 points 1 year ago (8 children) | Copy Link

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[–]TheRedPillRipperAn open mind opens doors. 1 point2 points3 points 1 year ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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Tran Dihn and Steven W. Gangestad, the creators of the original study of this hypothesis, already released a new paper in 2022 where they talk about the new and old replication studies and even admit that there's not enough evidence to conclude that women sexual desire differs all that much and that a woman's sexualiry is not well understood enough to display a difference between certain males.

So this idea that discussion is getting stifled and no one wants to expose women or whatever is huge cope. There's almost 2 decades' worth of research here, including meta analysis.

The only merit that this hypothesis has had thus far is that women are more attracted to men who are psychically fit, and women's sexual desire grows during ovulation. But even that second point is not fully understood since it's not understood which direction that sexual desire goes. From the research, the sexual desire is not towards men with "good genes" or Chad's, "as you guys say. So, really, all that was really proven was that women showed a preference towards men who were physically fit.

Overall, this hypothesis doesn't have much going for it. If it can't be replicated, then it's useless to try to use it to explain a woman's sexuality and preferences.

[–]VWGUYWV 4 points5 points6 points 1 year ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]ZabadoodudePurple Pill Man 16 points17 points18 points 1 year ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]ComfortableJeansMan, Aspiring Skitarii ⚙️ 20 points21 points22 points 1 year ago* (10 children) | Copy Link

It feels as though his partner is saying, "I don't find you especially sexually exciting, but you make up for lacking in that regard sufficiently enough in other ways for me to look past it." Which is obviously hurtful.

No one wants to feel as though their partner, the person they presumably love, doesn't find them sexually stimulating.

If a Hook Up is a role that is overwhelmingly predominantly sexual appeal based, and a Relationship is a role, which is sexual appeal is a factor, plus other factors, to say a person isn't one of the people you'd hook up with, but would be in a relationship with, does feel as though it heavily implies that they're not on the sexual appealing level of past hook ups, but make up for it other factors.

Whether it's what she meant, what he likely heard would have been akin to him saying to her "You know, Honey. I've fucked hotter girls than you, but you sure do have a good personality!"

Correct or incorrect, I do feel it's entirely reasonable for her partner to come to a conclusion that he finds hurtful.

It's shitty to see people gaslighting the guy for justifiably being hurt by what she said.

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Women always say offensive bullshit like this and it’s so annoying. I cant count the amount of times girls who partake in hookup culture will say some bs about other guys

Its actually crazy. I dont see men constantly comparing women to their exes or ex hookups directly to the woman’s face like women do

In my past, women have literally talked about how theyve been with guys with huge dicks or how theyd cum easily if a guy had a 8 inch cock. Also talked about how life would be great if they were with a rich guy, etc. And they also love showing you they have options and simps all in their dms

Tf is up with women and constantly comparing men theyre seeing with top 5% men so directly. Its so unnecessary and stupid. I dont see men telling women ‘ah ive been with a girl with way bigger tits than yours but you’re decent!’

It really shows the female mindset is so unsympathetic toward the male mindset. They dont understand anything that goes into becoming an attractive man and it shows. I feel like men understand women so much better than the other way around simply because we are forced to have attractive personalities and understand women if we want any shot at dates / sex

But i guess thats the nature of the game when men literally have to build up their attractiveness for years and win women over whereas women just see only the top 50% of men as humans and bottom 50% as ghosts. Must be also affected by the fact that top men approach women more often so women are inundated with experiences with top men who are down to fuck them and throw them away smfh

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