Are men really struggling to get sex/relationships in real life?

marshymarsh1 · 2023-01-12T07:43:42+00:00

I think it's more about the fact that the total rate of lonely men is increasing as the years progress. Obviously there have always been men (and women) who struggle to find relationships and sex, but something seems to be increasing that problem in the modern dating landscape especially for men. My two cents is the internet and dating apps as a possible explanation.

HighlyVolatile · 2023-01-12T09:22:34+00:00

I’ve been single for nearly 10 years, so I definitely fall into this category.

Then again, I’m not into casual relationships, and childfree women are hard to find. So yes, the struggle is real.

abaxeron · 2023-01-12T12:26:40+00:00

Are men really struggling to get sex/relationships in real life?

Yes.

As I dont believe that reflects reality.

You know how we say that men below a woman's beauty threshold are invisible to her? Well, case in point.

Fancy-Respect8729 · 2023-01-12T11:50:50+00:00

A good relationship with two people aligned is challenging to find for anyone. But not impossible.

PuertoRock007 · 2023-01-12T07:48:06+00:00

Just struggling to get sex and relationships from girls that are worth a dam. Can't tell you how many 5's I know that think they deserve a guy that's a 10. Or how many girls only want to act right and be serious about a relationship now that they're a single mom.

EnteFetz · 2023-01-12T15:17:42+00:00

I have to assume you are a woman, but have you ever considered that you only notice attractive men? Most men are totally invisible to you. The only men you actively think about are the very top percentiles of men you encountered that week or men who you were forced to interact with. A very large fraction of men are effectively invisible to women either because they are too ugly, too awkward or too shy and many men work in fields where there are no women. A lot of men spend most of their days not making eye contact with a woman even once.

Also the men in your social groups are definitely above average, because above average men have larger social groups and are therefore more visible. Look up the "popular friends paradox" if that sounds confusing to you.

When you think about the average man, you only take into consideration the men you notice and the men you know. But that is a highly filtered selection of top men. Your subjective average is miles above where the actual average men are.

A lot of men are desperately lonely or have given up on socialising at all. Women consistently chase the same few percentiles of top men, leaving a lot of men with absolutely zero interactions with women. And you won't notice or see these men until they show up on the news because they went on a killing spree.

ThunderLife92 · 2023-01-12T07:37:42+00:00

The issue is the exchange rate in dating.

Women inherently have the advantage, they have a lower cost of access to dating and sex.

Men are fairly simple, they want a woman they are attracted to, an average woman is generally attractive to the average guy. They also want a woman who is cooperatively romantic (shows love, respect and give sex).

What a woman wants is this but their bar is higher and then they want more on top of it, a man has to be relatively successful, attractive and be decent to them.

I am being very general as these elements branch into a lot of things especially the aspects of social dynamics.

A man has to be more than a man. A woman gets a man by being a woman alone and keeps him by giving sex and being good to him. A man has to do more to gain a woman and to maintain or an average woman will leave his ass because he's now suddenly a loser even if it is completely out of his control (women do go through this too, these are just general realities between women and men).

tidepodforbreakfast · 2023-01-12T13:17:01+00:00

Tech worker in FAANG. I was overweight, by like 30-40lb. I spent 2.5 years on dating apps and didn't get a single conversation with a woman. Just got ghosted after matching and a message or two repeatedly.

I got fit, muscular, updated my photos and within a week two women had asked ME out. I was always attractive, confident, good natured. It just didn't matter because I was overweight. Within a week I had gone on 5 dates with 5 different women.

Its then really funny how women like to say looks don't matter when all the studies say they do and moreso for women then men, l o l.

Lift_and_Lurk · 2023-01-12T14:05:41+00:00

Most average dudes are doing average which is fine. Some are doing very well. But the few struggling are reallly struggling. To add salt to the wounds social media shows all the ones doing really well (cause they post the most) and outs that right in the hands of every struggling dude who has a smart phone.

AreOut · 2023-01-12T07:26:06+00:00

it depends, a 5/10 man who has no problems dating a 2/10 woman is doing OK, the problem is when average man wants to date an average woman

Aromatic_Shop9033 · 2023-01-12T08:27:29+00:00

Yes, OP.

Impossible as it sounds, there are men that can't get a good woman. No, not a fucking supermodel. A loyal, kind, feminine woman.

I was prepared to die alone by age or my own intervention until my fiance met me. She's all the above and more. Her kind are rare.

The standards are absurd, when most women bring nothing except sex, drama, and excessive entitlement.

For these reasons, and others, some men give up, as I did.

domdomdom333 · 2023-01-12T10:59:08+00:00

I've been on about 30 dates, none have worked out, a lot of them were catfish setups or used me as an entry point to get with my friends. Casual sex is a no go, women are immediately disinterested if you lack experience. No one seems to want to go through the hassle of teaching a guy.

I'm in my mid twenties. Haven't been in a relationship, haven't had sex, not even a kiss.

From my experience this seems to be a pretty common trope amongst men these days. Even for my friends. I have some 10 close guy friends. All decent looking, all have stable good income jobs, all have a newish cars yet 6/10 of them I'd bet are still virgins. Never seen them in a relationship and always have nothing to add when it comes to sexual experiences. One guy can't seem to land a relationship but has plenty of casual hook ups and the rest 3/10 are in a stable relationship.

My close friends circle very much reflects that which is the current narrative that men are unable to mature further from the lack of relationships and sexual experiences that they can't get.

melody_of_ · 2023-01-12T11:43:08+00:00

Relative to womens ability to get it sure. Men are the ones planning and intiating the courtship movinf conversations along. Suffering the burden of performance to be funny entertaining / engaging to be considered as well as improving their looks status resources while women donr need to do any of this remotely at the same level

All of this and male sexlessness is still rising. It is somewhat mitigated by the fact that after all that usaully fruitless struggle many men being for the time "good enough" when she reaches late 20s/30s and wants to settle down and needs to sort through the best of them at her leisure. But yea young men struggling men in relationships obviously arent nearly as likely to struggle to get sex for now.

Will these socital trends get worse? Certainly. Even if their were large scale efforts to push men into Lifestyle choices that maximize their attractiveness due to online enviroments obliterating geographical barriers to entry not only would the amount of sexless men stay about the same such efforts would likely lead to a runaway hypergamy effect. Thinking Ape actually did an interesting video on the topic.

In the age of online dating there isn't any realistic solution for men and women to pair up more frequently outside of socially pressuring women to date men they dont find attractive in this age of abundant dating options. Such a solution would be largely incompatible to western anglosphere populations who assign a high value to concepts of personal autonomy and freedom.

That being said as technology improves their will likely be more sophisticated ways to simulate sex and pair bonding virtually as well as many existing methods of entertainment becoming better men will at least have many distractive activities.

Will this negatively effect birth rates the political dispositions of sexless mens and their productivity? Of course all social choices have effects. But there isn't any viable solution so just work on getting the best type of life you can for yourself and your loved ones out of the current society.

-Bazuso- · 2023-01-12T08:48:14+00:00

Well I suppose if you drop all your standards dating will be easier

CringeButCorrect · 2023-01-12T08:41:58+00:00

If you are female, there's a good chance you only talk to men who are somewhat attractive and have little issues dating. This will skew your perception. Only around 1/4 can easily get into a relationship when single. Additionally, 1/4 of men will really really struggle.

The average non-obese male (in America) will only have 1-2 realtionships by age 35, maybe a couple hookups over the years if they are a drinker. Their female equivalents will have the option to enter as many relationships as they want, but often they turn down the vast majority of those options.

Sad_Top1743 · 2023-01-12T08:08:36+00:00

Finding a good quality relationship after like 25 is not easy. A mediocre one is obtainable.

For casual sex it’s very difficult unless he’s got low standards

L9L28Gw1 · 2023-01-12T23:59:09+00:00

I work in tech in a major city and it’s crazy how many of my guy coworkers (myself included) who make ($100,000+) and just don’t interact with any women outside of work because they gave up after constant rejections IRL and no matches in online dating. These guys aren’t awkward at all with the girls at work At all and some could even be considered charming.

anjovis150 · 2023-01-12T09:17:22+00:00

Something like 1 out of 3 men had 0 sex past year (young men) and roughly 1 out of 3 marriages are sexless.

So yeah?

CopperknickersII · 2023-01-12T08:15:55+00:00

Yeah, many of us struggle in real life. I guess you don't know us because we're the guys you ignored and bullied in high school, and you've forgotten that those of us who didn't commit suicide yet still exist. Though mostly we keep to our bedrooms so you won't meet us much off the internet. I guess we always struggled to a degree. The difference is that in my dad's generation, there were no dating apps and most girls actually wanted relationships, so there was pretty much a guarantee our dads would find someone if they just kept looking. Some of my friends still haven't found a girlfriend, and I wouldn't have if I didn't move to a poorer country where I'm considered as exotic and interesting.

Far_Albatross_Far · 2023-01-12T07:29:58+00:00

I'd have no problems if I lowered my standards to below my league, but I won't.

spongeboymebob321 · 2023-01-12T08:41:04+00:00

I think a lot of people saying that are teenagers who are just now realizing that women like attractive men but idk for sure

NockerJoe · 2023-01-12T07:30:07+00:00

Depends on the guy. I know some guys who got around, some dudes struggling, and some dudes turning up dry and getting shut down at the outset. These aren't all in the same social circle but I wouldn't call any of them better than the other or more socially adept. All their physical attributes aside they're usually looking for different women for different reasons and its less about them as people and more that a dude with a fast lifestyle and an untreated mental illness will easily find sketchy or naive women, and the square and kinda uptight nerd is going to mostly want a vaguely respectable woman who has to tick more boxes and he's probably looking for a monogamous relationship that needs even more boxes ticked.

Any-Chipmunk5197 · 2023-01-12T09:42:37+00:00

The range of experiences is too wide to have any real "most men" conclusion

have had a couple of relationships/casual sex encounters

Someone who has had sex with 2 women in the last decade and another with 10 would both qualify for this description but obviously one struggles much more than the other. So it really depends on what you mean by "not struggle"

purplish_possum · 2023-01-12T13:24:29+00:00

most guys in real life do not overly struggle with getting relationships and they usually have had a couple of relationships/casual sex encounters.

So a 30 year old guy who had 2 short relationships and 3 casual encounters years ago is not struggling?

TheDustLord · 2023-01-12T15:42:37+00:00

I’m 6’4”, very handsome, and make an upper middle class income, and I’m still struggling. I’ve been single for about 5 years and have only had maybe 8 dates in that time.

I get a fair amount of attention from women (they’ve complimented me and sometimes asked for my phone number) and tons of matches on dating apps, but I just get ghosted constantly. I’ve had relationships before and I know how to be a great boyfriend, but women never seem to want to reciprocate my effort.

LovingOnOccasion · 2023-01-12T08:57:34+00:00

Not trying to shame you in particular but I really wish we, as a society, can get away from opening conversations about population statistics with "In my experience".

No, the few hundred people you've gotten to know in your lifetime are not a representative sample size and do nothing outside of creating a strong bias you'll need to overcome.

As to the question - The number of men with this issue is rising at a moderate pace and unfortunately young men tend to behave poorly when facing life circumstances that they find unappealing.

It's a problem but certainly not to the scale that this subreddit claims.

Shebalied · 2023-01-12T15:08:03+00:00

I think the biggest issues is most men have struggle in the talking to women / connecting. We can blame the apps and how younger people connect as they tik tok their way to talking or use apps instead of in person. From what I hear from most women is some of those guys spend time talking about their own life and do a poor job in going back and forth.

I think a lot of people who post online are the people who are having the issues is which is seems so big. Same with women, very few women I know from work or college use reddit. Only the angry bitter people seem to be online from both sides.

EventSea8621 · 2023-01-12T22:47:01+00:00

26m virgin, never even been on a date. Worked since i was 19 in mainly retail/kitchen work.

Also its important to not argue with anectdotal evidence and instead look at the actual statistics, is the majority of the population sexless? no. But the number is definitely increasing yearly mainy for men.

jobbo321 · 2023-01-12T09:35:22+00:00

I am, can't even get fatties I wouldn't look twice at in public to respond

H8beingmale · 2023-01-12T13:35:54+00:00

well it seems there is a rise in lonely single men

Administrative-Lie85 · 2023-01-12T16:48:07+00:00

Social life is dead. Yes, men are struggling, as dating apps/online dating are pretty much the only acceptable ways to try and interact with women

Diligent_Divide_4978 · 2023-01-13T05:08:09+00:00

If you're Asian, it'll be really hard.

InfiniteEating · 2023-01-12T07:33:35+00:00

I think this place exaggerates men's struggles quite a bit. Men don't struggle in the sense that it's impossible or nearly so to have sex or date, but we do have to put in quite a bit of effort to achieve these things--certainly more effort than women. It's also exaggerated by the fact that OLD is literally free pickings for women and a bloodbath for men.

Early-Christmas-4742 · 2023-01-12T09:47:35+00:00

It should really go without saying that a sub about dating issues will have a dissproportionate amount of men that have issues with dating.

The average man isn't going tl have trouble dating, unless he goes down the path of refusing accept anything short of Chad treatment. Most men IRL do seem to get relationships.

I'd say maybe bottom 25% of men are really struggling.

TheScabSlayerTRP · 2023-01-12T07:41:02+00:00

https://www.bbc.co.uk/bbcthree/article/f98ed501-d075-4b3a-abca-7e46bd8904cf

Your experience is your experience.

West-Ad-9697 · 2023-01-12T13:44:54+00:00

People are struggling with dating in general.

Nobody is actually communicating, putting themselves on the line or compromising - while at the same time - everyone is a relationship expert that expects the best deal possible and is determined to settle for nothing less while aspiring to be a full time narcisists.

We just struggle in different ways - some are in a loveless roommate relationship but it's ok because they are such good friends, others get humiliated every weekend by their wife but convinced themselves it's an act of love, some are lonely, some are lonely and masturbate to books, some have a boyfriend and a cock on the side, some have a wife, marriage, and kneeling secretary, others are just good fucking and cry in the same bed at night.

What else do you expect from a generation of children that were told - you figure that relationship stuff yourself, be free and experience whever you want. And we did. And we learned pain hurts, and ego rules.

FlyV89 · 2023-01-12T09:02:25+00:00

I don't think most men are struggling to get sex/relationships more than they did like, lets say 50 years ago. Comparing to their grandpas and fathers, most men are doing quite well in that regard.

The problem comes when these men compare themselves to women and a minority of the most sought after men in the market who pretty much have it better than anyone else, and that's when most guys feel like falling short.

So, yeah, overall 100% of dudes are just fine and can get sex and relationships... Sometimes... Somewhat frecuently... With some effort... Like, you get the point.

For "modern" standars thou, no, most men struggle a lot.

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publius2023 · 2023-01-12T07:59:44+00:00

I did a poll at my large university that had 200 respondents and 50% never had a significant other so there’s that

avarciousRutabega99 · 2023-01-12T12:42:47+00:00

Yes and no, speaking for myself only.

Ok-Explorer-4428 · 2023-01-12T13:31:32+00:00

Men, who are average or below average on looks, stasus and game, yes

KayRay1994 · 2023-01-12T13:55:44+00:00

in a way, yes - IRL dating struggles are more equal than online dating, in that men and women both struggle to an extent. People are more isolated than ever and mental health is a bit of a mess for many, economic struggles play a role as well

CombinationUsed7938 · 2023-01-12T14:25:12+00:00

It depends on a lot of factors.

Mostly: attractiveness, standards, social skills, lifestyle.

bootyhunter69420 · 2023-01-12T14:52:09+00:00

No_Reflection_798 · 2023-01-12T15:03:01+00:00

Yep. I'm told that I'm an above average male. Would like to be in a relationship. Cannot find one.

Can you add "affection" to the "sex/relationship" dichotomy?

bodaciousbonsai · 2023-01-12T15:57:43+00:00

Just because they're invisible to you doesn't mean they don't exist

Workaholiconew · 2023-01-12T18:13:14+00:00

Are men really struggling to get sex/relationships in real life?

Yes, yes they are, many are still using an outdated way of pursuing sex, we call them "beta" in TRP which is about obtaining resources to attract mates, the problem is, takes ages to obtain said resources, even more with current economy, and thus they are mostly sexless and relationship-less for most of their young lives.

In my experience most guys in real life do not overly struggle with
getting relationships and they usually have had a couple of
relationships/casual sex encounters.

And most people are never having work issues either... but considering the economy... it is obvious it is all just a facade too.

Look, people, and particularly men don't like to be bitches and be nagging left and right about their issues in life. Also, the more you act that way the less likely you are to be romantically and sexually successful if you are a man. Thus why so many men just lie, and say they have no issue... I mean I am sure you can imagine at least a few cases where men lied about their romantic and sexual success absurdly... It is for that reason.

And finally, many men are just down right busy with life, we have to care for parents, careers, jobs, etc. We only have our own resources, and a little bit left from our parents from when we were kids... Many times you don't know someone is struggling, cause you cant talk to them, as they work 16hours a day and barely can afford living. So no shit you dont know them... you just interact with those who dont struggle.

So I'm confused when guys on here make it seem like there is some global
problem when it comes to mens dating struggles. As I dont believe that
reflects reality.

Because it is a global problem, as it is caused by the westernization of women (at least in our countries)... Western women demands absurd amounts of time, energy, money, patience and more from men... Look, I dont know other countries, but western women are considered the least tolerant and tolerable women on earth for a reason... They are extremely uncompromising, and uncooperative, and the fact our women are copying this behavior makes our nations harder to live in.

odd_cloud · 2023-01-12T18:54:43+00:00

The answer depends on what specifically you call "struggling". How are "guys in your experience" not struggling specifically?

I ask this, because a group of people label guys, who have problems with attracting women, as "not struggling'.

Some women from this group don't really know a lot about typical dating experience of a man. They often talk to men they date only, or do not have close male friends who would be open to discussing dating with them. Other women know that guys have less attention from the opposite sex than women have, but they believe it must be a ok for men, because they are men.

Some guys from this group often think that having 10 dates and 2 LTRs in their 20s is "having no problem in dating". Some people believe men are not struggling because they see men and women outside. Well, when I was single, I could be seen with a woman, but it doesn't mean I was not struggling. I think, in order to judge whether a guy is struggling or not, you should know his dating history, which means you must be really close to him.

Noble_trader · 2023-01-12T20:50:29+00:00

Getting sex and relationships isn’t too hard but those are likely to be with unattractive women. Finding someone who is visually attractive and you vibe with is a bit harder.

Holden_Frame · 2023-01-12T21:08:13+00:00

This is such simple math it shouldn't be debatable.

Start with these facts:

Men find it difficult to go without sex for long periods, physically and mentally
Women find it exceedingly easy (in comparison) to do so

Thus, women will generally be far more selective in who they eventually do have sex with.

If a man had 30 attractive enough women standing in front of him and the rule was "You can only fuck one", he'd start looking at all kinds of crazy criteria as well to choose what (to him) is "the best"

Of course, this is the world women live in. Average men live in a world where they almost always have 0 women on offer.

Also, now that the dating market is virtually globalized, more and more women have the ability (or believe they do) to get a man who checks every single one of their boxes to the letter.

Result: An ever increasing number of men, now competing with a vastly larger pool of competitors will lose out.

The only question is, have we reached the peak of this phenomenon yet?

calfshrug · 2023-01-12T21:37:10+00:00

They’re either secretly medicating and coping, they’re doing well because they’re decent looking and socially /otherwise skilled (including rich and successful enough), or they’re asexual/gay/bisexual (last comma delineated section can also overlap) In fact any of these categories can overlap.

You need to realize that some normal men who don’t seem sexually desperate actually are and hide it well. Some of them statistically are also murderers, rapists, CP viewers, or pederastic rapists.

What you people on Reddit need to realize is that just because someone comes across like a dickhead, like me for example, doesn’t mean that a person is evil. Likewise, someone who seems benign can be evil under the veil.

Most likely though OP, the people you know are sexually fulfilled mostly to their desire due to having built up necessary social skills, circles, and perhaps by not being bullied or by having developed experience with dating and making friends when they were younger.

Finally - almost all men are incels, and if you stretch to include women and the fact that most of them secretly wish they could sleep with GQ cover models, Zac Efron, etc, then even women are technically incels

Severe-Pirate · 2023-01-12T22:15:36+00:00

Yes. Recent studies have shown that the rate of loneliness and sexlessness are rising for men.

k_aevitas · 2023-01-12T23:40:07+00:00

..there's A LOT of people on this earth. Even if you meet 1 million people with no issues having partners there's several billion left in the world from all ages, socio economic backgrounds, mental state, personal history and everything of all infinite ranges that struggle with relationships of varying degrees. Also not everything is what it seems, you don't truly know someone's love lives just by observing either. Sometimes people can not have issues landing people but it can be shallow horrible relationships

Ahpairee · 2023-01-13T01:55:29+00:00

You just don't see the ones who are.

Kobe_curry24 · 2023-01-13T04:17:12+00:00

The fact op made the comment on this sub already proves it Lmfaoooo

MasterTeacher123 · 2023-01-13T11:32:40+00:00

I think most men take what they can get

SoldierExcelsior · 2023-01-14T04:24:14+00:00

Most guys aren't going to be honest about it except on anonymous platforms.

Most guys probably 80% don't have the ability to go out get sex or a relationship.Even if your in a relationship you probably can't just leave her and get another girl.

The struggle is real the bar is extremely high but the bar isn't even straight it's crooked...Standards for attractive men are lower than for less attractive men...furthermore many woman preffer being a side chick or baby momma to an attractive man than to "settle" with an average man

Alot of men have just left the game entirely especially the average men this just leaves the above average men and the psychos this is the problem women have,their only options are Guys like Future or The Tinder Swindler.Guys in the middle have given up...There's probably a third option of young immature men that haven't been redpilled yet but women don't want some 20 year old with no car that still lives at home

I don't date in the traditional sense I use old but I don't approach women if they approach me sure I will go on a date but I don't put in any effort or message them first.

instead deal with escorts its simple easy straight to the point and lots of men are doing it..I know a few escorts personally and their schedules are booked seeing 5 maybe 10 guys a day.Hooking up is so easy these days I don't understand the whole incel thing or using only fans lol I'm not paying for a video of a chick.

Speaking of platforms like only fans,tik tok, twitch etc alot of men are watching that stuff, rubing one out and not even bothering to date or actually meet women.

I gave up dating along time ago most women still on the market at my age have mental health,drug use,emotional disorders severe ones..the younger ones aren't much better and they are all broke and struggling immature and Theres a culture gap since they've been raised to be strong, independent and think they are a man's equal...unless she can kick my ass she's not my equal.

this chick was telling me about all her degrees and telling me how she doesn't need a man for anything so why do I have a text from her asking for $500 to pay her phone bill? Its a clown world.

So currently I have no dating or relationship prospects sure maybe I could get a 50 year old single mom but that doesn't make any sense when I can hook up with 21 year Olds with a text.Single Women my age are a lost cause and younger women are brainwashed liabilities and since I'm probably not that attractive maybe a 6,and refuse to simp or pander I'm not getting a relationship unless I go overseas which is the plan as I'm building a house there now.

SolidPuzzleheaded984 · 2023-01-12T09:33:26+00:00

Yes with avg to above avg women.

An avg guy can get with a 2/10 girl tho

ArmDiscombobulated29 · 2023-01-12T13:15:27+00:00

Y’all need to clap some cheeks

obviousredflag · 2023-01-12T09:41:01+00:00

So I'm thinking this sub may just have a lot of below average guys perpetuating this idea that males are struggling in dating when really in real life the average guy isn't.

Exactly. I want to add, that the guys here might even be average attractive, average income, average height, etc. all these hallmark traits of what they think are (only) relevant for desirability. But they fail to see the traits in them that make them very very unattractive and undesirable. Even in online dating, YOU are not YOUR PROFILE. YOU might be average, but YOUR PROFILE is not, and it is what get's swiped on.

haroldshipman_MD · 2023-01-12T12:39:52+00:00

Not in my experience of life. It's part of the reason I find the things posted on this sub to be so bizarre and perplexing.

I wouldn't say me or my friends are anything out of the ordinary, but none of us ever experienced difficulty establishing or maintaining casual or longterm relationship with women, and that's both via OLD and real life meetings.

I hear all the statistics touted on here. I just don't see it.

Capeninja · 2023-01-12T07:34:48+00:00

[permanently deleted]

TheRedPillRipper · 2023-01-12T07:27:25+00:00

TRP, and those that subscribe to it, are a minority.

mc0079 · 2023-01-12T18:13:38+00:00

It's not the reality, just these PPD dudes who are terminally online and socially stunted

epicgamer1986 · 2023-01-12T20:45:20+00:00

Yes. End of thread.

smarmycheesesandwich · 2023-01-12T15:23:35+00:00

Not at all. Many of us are struggling to get into relationships with people we find attractive though, lol. Big time. 😂

Ohyarlysmiles · 2023-01-12T18:39:46+00:00

Most men will always struggle to get casual sex

I don't think most men are struggling to get into relationships.

HighestTierMaslow · 2023-01-12T15:44:10+00:00

I agree with you and I suspect the men on here that complain they are a good catch and cannot find a woman 1) are extremely introverted and never leave the house. You have to put yourself out there to see results or 2) have mental issues/personality flaws- extreme social awkwardness, overshoot for the type of woman they think they deserve due to arrogancy or their mean spiritedness/misogyny repels women (women pick up on this vibe) I bet most are #2 based on what they write lol

This forum is ridiculous- very rarely do I see a post where I see the dynamics described in my actual real life and I have met a crap ton of people, way more than the average person who is here. I use this forum to simply kill time.

Most couples are average people paired together and there arent crazy imbalances. Although the men here love to take the top 5% of richest men and generalize to everyone based on that.

vorter · 2023-01-12T13:43:51+00:00

Kind of? I’d say most struggle at first then less as they get older but it depends on a lot of factors like location and social exposure. I do think it’s become much harder for introverted/shy guys, especially since they gravitate to dating apps which are objectively much harder for men.

With decline in shared social spaces and the rise of social media, endless entertainment, and dating apps there’s less incentives for introverted men and women to go out and meet in person. These also contribute to our current mental health crisis and being bombarded with gender war bs from each gender doesn’t help much either.

Ohmaygahh · 2023-01-12T15:25:18+00:00

Are men really struggling? Overall I would have to say yes.

If we oversimplify men, between high and low libido and high and low inhibition we get:

High libido, high inhibition: Basically healthy men who are not interested in casual sex, are holding out for a special woman. In my opinion, this lot have very distorted, incorrect and limiting beliefs about woman, sex, and romance. These guys are hopeless/strangely religious.

High libido, low inhibition: Healthy men who desire women. This group splits into 80/20, meaning 80% of this group are unable to connect with similarly minded women/mess up their chances for whatever reason. The 20% of this group are your normal Chads, from regular midwestern corn fed Chad to shredded up urban Chad you can find in the city or pool foam party in Cancun/Acapulco during spring break.

Low libido, high inhibition: The worst of both worlds. You're asexuals demisexuals live here. They need testosterone replacement therapy and enrollment into combat sports, in my opinion.

low libido, low inhibition: These guys also need additional help.

So speaking of the group of men that are healthy, have full mental and physical and emotional faculties, and desire women, only a small silver of men in this group get to exercise full control of their sexual lives. Women disproportionately reward the top tier men ( and make no mistake, sex is a lot of things, and it also is a reward in the primal, pavlonion sense ).

And this is where the debate rages.

mugdul · 2023-01-12T20:01:43+00:00

Oh, men struggling to get sex and relationships? Please, that's just a myth. I mean, in my vast experience, most guys don't seem to have any trouble getting laid or finding someone to date. I mean, sure, the average guy might not be sleeping with a different woman every week, but that's just common sense, right? I mean, how could so many men really be struggling with dating and relationships? It's not like it's a real problem or anything. And as for the guys on this sub, well, I'm guessing they're just a bunch of losers who can't get laid. So why bother listening to them? They're just perpetuating this idea that men are struggling in dating when really, in real life, the average guy is just fine.

2023-01-12T21:17:01+00:00

Yes you are exactly right. The only guys I know irl who completely struggle to get a relationship are ones with a serious lack in social skills or emotional intelligence. Men on reddit often fit this category.

The guys that I know that are especially popular with women have relatively high EQ and social skills. They are good listeners - show concern and interest in women's lives. They usually talk about others more than themselves. They actually listen and empathize with women and treat them like individuals. They are also more agreeable. I guess these are universal traits that make them popular people in general.

Khabeni412 · 2023-01-12T22:55:00+00:00

Much more so than women that's for sure. The internet dating sites have turned women selfish and superficial. Most women, for example, have height requirements on their profile. But get mad if men have weight requirements. Women are allowed and encouraged to be happy with their body. Men are body shamed a lot more than women. Personally, I'm done with superficial women. Unless your six foot four or have a million dollars, women hate you.

Garfish16 · 2023-01-12T23:08:05+00:00

You're just wrong. I dated around and had sex in college maybe a dozen partners on and off and one long term relationship over the corce of 4 years. Since I graduated about 4 years ago it's been incredibly hard to meat women. I've had 1 partner in 4 years. Nothing changed about me. I'm in the same shape physically, I have the same hobbies, and now I actually have an income.

The problem is society makes it incredibly hard for men to engage in partner speaking behavior. Where exactly is it socially appropriate to try to flirt with a woman as a man?

ProfessorFelix0812 · 2023-01-12T15:56:24+00:00

This sub is full of socially awkward dudes that haven’t seen the inside of a vagina since the day they were born. It’s not indicative of all dudes in the least.

chancetolive · 2023-01-12T07:54:01+00:00

Nothing to worry about. No problems. No causes for concern. Continue your day as usual.
Everyone is struggling, men aren't uniquely struggling with anything especially dating, sex and relationships.
Incels are a small minority with no possible legitimate grievances.
Women individually don't need to change anything for men collectively.

Affectionate_Sky960 · 2023-01-12T22:20:42+00:00

Ima say this I’m a chad but I think either r have severe social anxiety or I’m on the spectrum cause I do very well online with women but irl I’ve seen average guys get more women than me there more to attraction than just looks I just get away with it cause I’m goodlooking but I’m telling you being nuerotypical is number one for women. As I said I feel out of place in real life I’m taller and have bigger muscle than everyone I almost feel word the vast majority of men are average and I’m telling u therir doing alrite. For some reason women care about height and muscles online but in the real world I don’t see it all lol.

Embarrassed_Cup2524 · 2023-01-12T22:08:28+00:00

theres a difference between real men and "men who have intimacy issues and trauma"

nonameboredman · 2023-01-14T00:20:02+00:00

I never understood why men would struggle to have sex in our times. A man with proper financial means (as a proper man should be) can easily have sex with really attractive women by compensating their time.

social_mule · 2023-01-12T13:45:55+00:00

lurker7128 · 2023-01-12T15:57:10+00:00

“I don’t believe that reflects reality”

Ok, so you know the whole believe woman thing? How about we extend that to men? Yes, the average guy is generally struggling to meet the expectations women are placing on them. It’s not your fault as an individual woman, it’s a result of societal shifts.

Remarkable-Jump9125 · 2023-01-12T16:33:43+00:00

I do very well on online dating, but I never approach or look at women irl unless I've met them online. This is just my experience, though. I have zero confidence irl with women but lots of confidence online.

Average men do struggle quite a bit in real life. Maybe not as much as some claim on here, but they certainly do struggle a bit.

anonymousUser1SHIFT · 2023-01-12T16:52:19+00:00

In my experience most guys in real life do not overly struggle with getting relationships and they usually have had a couple of relationships/casual sex encounters.

The biggest difference is your normally not viewing/dealing with the "average men".

alphasupremacy5555 · 2023-01-12T16:57:17+00:00

Yes men are really struggling to get sex/relationships in real life. Well most men are because most men are average men and average women do not want average men. But it's not a global problem it's only a problem in Western countries like the US the UK and Canada. That's why so many Western men are going to the Philippines nowadays to get a wife.

But if you take the United States of America for example, most American men are struggling to get sex more so than relationships. Even getting a relationship is not easy but you can get both if you have no standards and you go for women you don't really want. The reality that people hate to accept is that the vast majority of women find a vast majority of men sexually undesirable, most women find most men unattractive. So a guy might be dating a woman consistently but it's almost guaranteed she's not sleeping with him.

For me right now I have to be focused on improving myself and working on myself as much as possible because I am an extremely sexually frustrated and voluntarily celibate 28-year-old virgin and I absolutely hate it. The only women I can get are the ones I really seriously do not want and don't find attractive in the slightest. I can't get any of the women I actually want.

armordog99 · 2023-01-12T17:06:36+00:00

This is completely anecdotal evidence but one of my best friends (we’ve been friends since elementary school and we are both in our fifties) is having no problems getting sex and relationships.

He was married for 18 years and has been divorced for ten. He has a new women about every 3-6 months. Very attractive women. He is not a very attractive man.

From our conversations he says he gets 15-20 hits from OLD apps every week. He is able to weed those down to 3-5 that are attractive enough for him.

Now he currently owns a medium size plastic manufacturing company and makes over $200,000 a year, owns a $350,000 home and drives a Mercedes. One of the OLD apps he uses required him to prove that he made over $100,000 a year.

He is the happiest I’ve ever seen him.

thenegativeone112 · 2023-01-12T18:03:24+00:00

It depends on the person and what you value. You will always have the attractive guys who play the game, be the villain type and win all the ladies. On the other end you will have people that value relationships over hookups and they can still do pretty well. The problem lies within the middle. If you’re an average to averagely attractive guy this is where I find the waters get muddy. I think sometimes society puts the dating failures of men solely on men. While sometimes true the problem lately how the psychology of dating has evolved only in the favor of women. Women of ratings average to super attractive all are fed a one sized fits all never settle excused based approach. If he doesn’t think you’re hot he’s the problem. If doesn’t like bigger women he’s fat phobic. He doesn’t make enough money to spoil you he ain’t worth it. So basically if you don’t have all the looks and bad boy type or whatever fits the narrative for women these days it can be very hard.

Disclaimer: I’m new to this sub so I hope I’m not going against what the sub is about. And obviously this doesn’t apply to everyone and there are so many other factors.

scwizard · 2023-01-12T18:03:30+00:00

they usually have had a couple of relationships/casual sex encounters

This is true but it's also true that guys are more likely to be lonely than previous generations, and also true that guys under 30 are orders of magnitude more likely to be single than girls under 30.

Ok-Talk-4303 · 2023-01-12T18:38:37+00:00

In my experience most guys in real life do not overly struggle with getting relationships and they usually have had a couple of relationships/casual sex encounters.

You have to take into consideration that there can be a bias here. If these men are part of your social circle as a woman, they are likely not maladapted or struggling.

wtbrift · 2023-01-12T19:06:03+00:00

I think negative people and experiences will always make up most posts and give this impression.

As for me, I have honed in on what seems to work for me in regards to dating and I'm happy with the results.

odd_cloud · 2023-01-12T19:13:52+00:00

I think it should make sense that ordinary men struggle, because men are expected to initiate. I think, if you are an attractive guy and get many positive resopnses from women, you feel pretty comfortable in this system, where you make the first step. If you are ordinary, then your share of positive responses is smaller, and you may have very negative responses. You wouldn't feel as free in expressing your romantic interest in someone, which would decrease your chances further.

Neptune-Jr · 2023-01-12T19:15:36+00:00

As a man is way too easy to be single for long stretches of time.

Kaminaxgurren · 2023-01-12T19:35:56+00:00

I am in my mid twenties, and my relationship with romance has been nothing but negative. Not that a bunch of anecdotal evidence proves empirically that men as a whole struggle to get sex/relationships, of course, so really, this question can't necessarily be answered unless a lot of research is done.

Familiar_Egg8802 · 2023-01-12T19:37:33+00:00

Yes but if you're an insulated friend group you won't see it.

69Superior69 · 2023-01-12T19:45:55+00:00

i was sucessful through high school and college. living at home now so theres no “wyd come over text” at play but i have gotten lucky a couple times past couple months.

once i get my own place, i hope i can move from lucky every couple weeks to more active again. but cant make any assumptions bc i have gone through some dry phases when i had my own place - (19 living in college dorm)

i am also 6’1 which apparently makes a huge difference based on what i have read on the internet.

elegant-types · 2023-01-12T20:54:06+00:00

It’s a false premise to assume only average or below average men struggle with dating

you can be an above average guy (say a 7 out of 10) and still be single for 5-10+ years without dating.

lots of men are too shy, don’t make moves and the algorithms may even work against them in dating apps (they may get unlucky and despite being objectively attractive the algorithms may lump them in the unattractive bucket due to the mass left swipes almost all men receive).

lostnumber08 · 2023-01-12T21:00:43+00:00

No. Only on this sub. Weird coincidence, right?

DJJAMES0621 · 2023-01-12T21:10:46+00:00

Unfortunately that’s the reality some men have limitations for whatever reason and deal with tons of social expectations and stereotypes that some men can’t compete with so here we are

Square-Pie9671 · 2023-01-12T22:02:38+00:00

yes they do. just having had a couple of sexual encounters in years that were not to serious and still required efforts and lots of failure is the default for average guys and above average ones. that's struggling. men who dont struggle, meaning they can get a new woman they like within a couple of months even on a consistent basis are extremely rare, and being good looking alone doesnt cut it.

All the guys I know that truely get girls like its nothing have one thing in common, they also fail a lot, dont take no for an answer, treat women as disposable flesh bags, harass them, are also cringe af, and humiliate themselves alot, they just cant perceive shame and keep trying until they get laid.

regardless how a dude looks, it's impossible to consistently pick up girls without throwing away all dignity and self respect, getting rejected a lot, and literally be dumb enough to be immune to shame.

raldabos · 2023-01-12T22:03:55+00:00

Reddit is a place that a attracts certain public which is usually the type of person who probably doesn't have the best social skills, that's why is more common to see these types of men here HOWEVER, the amount of people who is like this definitely has been steadily increasing each year, specially men, there are bunch of studies on this topic:

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/young-adults-especially-men-having-sex-less-frequently

https://news.iu.edu/live/news/26924

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2019/03/29/share-americans-not-having-sex-has-reached-record-high/

Secret_agent979 · 2023-01-12T23:16:55+00:00

Get off OLD. Meet up with coworkers, friends, acquaintances, whatever. Catch a woman’s eye, if she holds more than a 5 seconds approach and talk. If she’s closed off than go back to your friends. Sit isn’t rocket science

SDW137 · 2023-01-13T00:25:08+00:00

I'm just curious, what is the sample size of these guys that you know? And how do you know for sure that they're "average", when they might actually be above average?

_here_ok · 2023-01-13T02:35:15+00:00

I think it's just a vocal group type situation. Guys in relationships don't really have much to complain about when it comes to pursuing a partner because they are preoccupied with maintaining their current partner. In which case they are more likely to complain about their partner over the process of getting one.

It's just that the internet really causes vocal groups to be so vocalized that they seem bigger than what they actually are.

Every lonely guy would have complained to his friends but now he can complain to the world.

ChibsFilipTelfordd · 2023-01-13T05:45:53+00:00

Short answer: no. Incels are under 3% of the population.

Long answer: most people are not on reddit or forums bitching about not getting laid. Most normal men are in ltrs with normal women of the same income level and social status and attraction.

preferablyno · 2023-01-13T05:49:05+00:00

I feel like you can’t answer this question without addressing how men feel about sex

By all objective measures I’ve had a lot of dates, one night stands, relationships, threesomes, fuckbuddies whatever, it’s just I have a sex drive and my internal state tells me I need to meet new girls and if I don’t I feel like I’m struggling

It’s calmed down a bit in middle age but I mean that’s not saying much it was like all consuming before now it’s just strong

justforlulz12345 · 2023-01-13T17:08:19+00:00

it's a problem with wider social isolation. the internet and social media and consumption culture has rotted the western world's ability to socialize.

Monkebizniss · 2023-01-13T18:55:57+00:00

I consider myself an average guy, and I do okay for myself. I’m not super in shape, super masculine or serial killer charming, and I’ve been in multiple relationships with women who weren’t fat or ugly, and still been the one to break it off several times. The average guy is doing okay.

The problem that incels/red pillers address is really just that there’s a subsection of men (and not really a subsection of women) who can’t get someone to even consider them as a sexual/romantic being, since the minimum standard for attraction is higher. That takes a toll on these men, and it sucks, and I feel for them.

But the other issue is that, especially with online dating, it SUCKS as a dude to try and compete on the dating market, when the only thing women are going off of is looks, and the vast majority of guys aren’t hot enough for the vast majority of girls to look at us and immediately see us as sexually attractive. This isn’t to say OLD doesn’t suck for women too, or that women don’t also face unreasonable beauty standards, but what people pushing the red pill focus on is sex, and even ugly women can get sex if they really want it.

kwilcox7 · 2023-01-13T21:08:16+00:00

The average man has immense problems with dating. Only the top 20% don't have those problems.

Swimming_Salary_8456 · 2023-01-13T21:26:02+00:00

I guess stats and research aren’t enough lol

Even married guys more often then not go without

Latter-Impression-26 · 2023-01-14T09:56:44+00:00

40% of college men are virgins. Stop being delusional. "crisis" is a gaslighting term. Noone is calling it that.

CloudsTasteGeometric · 2023-01-16T01:07:14+00:00

FWIW I'm a successful, socially skilled, very tall, fit handsome man (consistently rated a 9 or 10 on /r/rateme) and it can be a real struggle for me get relationships.

Women very (very) occasionally approach me (once a year or less) - but there are no socially appropriate venues for me to approach them. Perhaps a club (too loud to even talk) but that's about it. And I hate clubbing. In 2023 it is essentially sexual harassment to approach a woman you don't know in public - at a coffee shop, bookstore, bar, wherever. Anyone with a finger on the pulse of culture and modern social norms knows that they want to be left alone and don't want some guy who is a total stranger looking at her - let alone talking to her.

Which is understandable: even if you go in with the best intentions and ability to respect boundaries/accept rejection gracefully she doesn't know that. As a man you could been a loser, a creep, a stalker, or worse.

In the interest of being a decent human being: the very least you can do is not make women feel unsafe. Being a woman is hard enough as it is.

So what does that leave? Online dating. The very prospect of which gives me a headache (the majority of all my relationships started there because I literally had no other options) - why a headache? Because it's very hard to stand out on online dating. You don't just need to be attractive and successful (I am both of those things). You need to entertain them, by being witty and unexpected via text.

I'll admit: I'm terrible at that. In person, once I get to the actual date, I can be plenty charming. But getting to that point is VERY hard unless you're a very funny person via text message (on top of being good looking and successful).

Beyond that? Just hope a friend sets you up with someone they know. Something that is also rare these days. There just aren't enough socially acceptable ways for men to meet women to date.

Title	Are men really struggling to get sex/relationships in real life?
Author	Illustrious-Line-996
Upvotes	131
Comments	483
Date	January 12, 2023 7:13 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/109tawv/are_men_really_struggling_to_get_sexrelationships/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/are-men-really-struggling-to-get-sexrelationships.1146001 https://theredarchive.com/post/1146001

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