Men ignore conventionally unattractive women (they aren't even on their radar), so they assume that all women are privileged in dating

Junior_Ad_3086 · 2024-10-22T01:28:30+00:00

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guys_rock · 2024-10-22T03:37:15+00:00

Funny thing is I date "conventionally unattractive" women because their profiles make them seem like cutie patooties. They'll reject you faster than the standard hotties do. They seem to be so afraid of getting pumped and dumped that they don't even give you a chance.

Edit: there's a lot angwy people in the replies, so I'll just elaborate. There's nothing wrong with being defensive after getting pumped and dumped a lot. But I was just mentioning that these women aren't invisible, they date pretty easily. And they tend to be harder to date for the reasons I stated.

Typically what happens is they either take any sexual advancement as a pump n dump attempt and end it, or get very weird after having sex. I always go into these in good faith and it's not my intention to use them for sex.

Main_Aside_3072 · 2024-10-22T04:20:53+00:00

Not at all, this has been proved constantly online

Search "Women should do the "Pig Woman Experiment" on dating apps to really appreciate how worthless 'validation' is." in here.

Don't really know why this is so hard to accept to women. You don't lack attention, you lack attention from men you want, I'm sure that comes with its own set of problems but is totally different from unattractive men's experience in dating.

bzl33 · 2024-10-22T05:45:24+00:00

If that's your experience, I can't argue with it.

Personally the only women I've heard struggle to date and wanted to were very socially introverted. If you are decently good at striking up conversation, you should be able to find a couple guys interested in you if you spend a short time in a social setting. As a guy you need to do more to have women interested in you. It is as dire as people say online no, but it is definitely more than women attracting men.

Grow_peace_in_Bedlam · 2024-10-22T01:25:50+00:00

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Sad-Pen-3193 · 2024-10-22T02:54:47+00:00

Not to mention that getting used for sex (vs. just getting rejected immediately) isn’t really better for most women, even if they aren’t explicitly rejected.

This is the key difference, because those women are still getting laid, whereas conventionally unattractive men are literally getting nothing unless they have something really outstanding to offer otherwise. Also, for women, the attention and approaches come to you and you can further increase your odds by actually approaching men tactfully so you don’t look desperate. Unconventionally attractive men basically have to get rich, be funny, charismatic, in the best possible shape and with the best styling they can get and even then they’ll have a harder time than unattractive women unless they pay for sugar babies/hookers.

Nodeal_reddit · 2024-10-22T10:47:56+00:00

This is a straw man argument. Who says that men think “conventionally unattractive” women have it EASY when it comes to dating? I think most men would agree that fat, ugly women are not going to be drowning in options. It’s just that they HAVE options.

abaxeron · 2024-10-22T01:23:24+00:00

If all it takes for a person to literally drown in dating options is a non-negative amount of effort put into monitoring their body weight, this is a privilege.

Wanderingwombat1902 · 2024-10-22T01:21:47+00:00

For the vast majority of women, all they need to do is be a healthy weight and boom, they’re attractive. Weight is something you can control. So failure to control your weight and then complaint about dating is not something men have sympathy for when an average looking but in shape man can struggle with dating.

Yes, some women have ugly faces or certain defects but this isn’t true for most women. That’s why this is a generalization.

AdEffective7894s · 2024-10-22T03:40:56+00:00

The amount women have to crash through to be considered unattractive to the point of being deemed unwanted is much lower than what is equivalent for men.

Infact I can go ahead and argue that these women are also going for men at the top of the hierarchy just like you claim unsuccessful men do. Maybe they should lower their standards?

TheNattyJew · 2024-10-22T01:33:00+00:00

This is beyond wrong. There have been scads of social experiments where the largest, most obese woman can set up a profile and get hundreds of responses, while an average to above average man will get 2 or 3. Clearly women, ugly and fat, or not, have it easier than men

purplish_possum · 2024-10-22T02:46:08+00:00

Pretty fat women have no problem getting dates. Pretty fat women have no problem finding boyfriends. Pretty fat women have no problem find husbands.

BillSF · 2024-10-22T01:46:28+00:00

Not true, especially when you compare the experience of a conventionally unattractive woman (some attention) to an unattractive man (invisible).

I'm fairly good looking and I still find attractive features in a conventionally unattractive woman. Especially if the woman has an interesting (fun, funny, sweet, intelligent or combo) personality. The better the personality the more I'm likely to notice cute features (pretty eyes, cute nose, etc) even if on the whole they might be plain / ugly. It doesn't necessarily mean they are AS attractive as someone else, but they're most definitely not invisible.

Probably the most unusual for me is Linda Hunt, at least when I (and she) were younger. She always plays intelligent and capable characters and that's attractive (at least to me). She also has a friendly smile.

WhiteLotusGauntlet · 2024-10-22T02:03:23+00:00

Fat women who want to date fit men have it almost as hard as fit men who want to date fit women.

Still sounds like privilege to me.

Cool_Ranch_2511 · 2024-10-22T01:15:52+00:00

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This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

Aafan_Barbarro · 2024-10-22T06:24:49+00:00

So women can't be considered privileged unless it's "super easy" for all of them? We are supposed to ignore every difference and every advantage that a majority of women get to enjoy? What a terrible argument, people really struggle with generalizations nowadays.

steponmynutsnerd · 2024-10-22T07:48:11+00:00

Provably false

meisterkraus · 2024-10-22T13:28:39+00:00

You have to compare apples to apples not apples to oranges. When you look at a man and a woman of equal attractiveness the woman would have it easier. I can grant less attractive women have it harder than attractive women. They can also have it harder than an attractive men.

If we took a man and a woman of equal attractiveness, who would have it harder dating?

berichorbeburied · 2024-10-22T01:12:16+00:00

I’ve talked to “conventionally unattractive women”

And while I didn’t want to fuck them and I kept it entirely platonic.

What I learned is what you’re saying is false

They still have it laughably easy

they still have stories of men hitting on them
still think they are better than they actually are
still look down on average or short men
still have crushes of extremely attractive or rich men
still are very picky in their dating options
still declare all men want is sex
etc etc etc

Maybe you need to change your debate too

“ “Conventionally Attractive” women have it way easier than “conventionally unattractive” women”

blonde___guardian · 2024-10-22T01:17:09+00:00

Honestly, I wish men just ignored conventionally unattractive women. One of my best friends is fat and always has been. Lots of guys want to fuck her and hang out with her to the point of clinginess but are too ashamed to introduce her publicly as their girlfriend. It's not a desire problem or a compatibility problem; it's a mind-game of "I want to spend so, so much time with you, but nobody can know I spend time with you."

I don't want to generalize from one case study too much, but I'll throw out the stat that roughly 40% of women between 20-39 in the US are overweight. I don't think her experience is all that far out of the ordinary.

SomeSugondeseGuy · 2024-10-22T01:08:43+00:00

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Ok-Dust-4156 · 2024-10-22T06:44:37+00:00

They still get some attention, like they at least get matches in online dating. In same time nothing prevents them from making first move. If men had behaved in same way sitting on their asses waiting for a cute girl to fall from the sky, humanity would die out long time ago.

AnySmoke2016 · 2024-10-22T12:20:56+00:00

From this point of view you're right, but if Weight is the root for that problem its on her hands to work on it

Nihi1986 · 2024-10-22T13:04:04+00:00

This is not wrong, I can definitely see how conventionally unattractive women's experiences often flat out suck.

It's the average vs average where you see those privileges. Ugly guys have it worse, though, at least in the sense that they get used for other reasons when they get attention instead of used for sex (which I understand is not a good deal for women, but you still get some of the pseudo relationship stuff).

Anyway, wouldn't really want to make a competition to see who have It worse... Unattractive women aren't particularly privileged in dating though by virtue of being a woman it's always going to be easier than it is for non Chad males...

TopShelfSnipes · 2024-10-22T13:49:18+00:00

"Conventionally unattractive" and obese are two different things and should not be conflated.

Obesity is a lifestyle, a choice, except in extreme outliers.

Conventionally unattractive will be attractive to someone with a niche preference. If she is fit, she'll find someone. This is where the sterotype of the 'Butterface' (read: 'But her face') comes in. Those women can get attention, and aren't starved for options. She will have fewer options, but she will have options.

The same is generally true for "conventionally unattractive men"

Obesity is its own category. Except for people with a kink, fat people are generally universally unattractive, and if they don't like not getting attention, they should lose the weight or stop complaining.

JJVamps · 2024-10-22T14:38:12+00:00

Women aren’t considered as unattractive as men, even if they are the same attractiveness. Do some women have issues with dating? Of course.

But most women’s dating issues (at least in the sense of being able to attract someone) is mostly self-inflicted. Like they are extremely socially introverted and can’t talk to people, they aren’t approachable, they have standards that are unreasonably high, too self-conscious, etc.

So yeah, women have dating problems, but most of the time it’s self inflicted and could easily be dealt with by simply being more approachable or socially aware. I get the sentiment that not every girl can just wake up and get a new guy by the end of the day as some people imply, that’s always been a little ridiculous to me.

Ibn-Ach · 2024-10-22T15:21:12+00:00

you are partialy right, but believe me, for men is much harder.

GradeAPlussy · 2024-10-22T15:56:06+00:00

I find it interesting that the women in this discussion are saying "things go both ways" and the men are saying "things go one way".

Bubbly_Pension4020 · 2024-10-22T01:52:19+00:00

I’ve found that not only do fat chicks get sexual offer frequently, but that girls that don’t show their faces online will often get simps solely from the abstract knowledge that it’s allegedly a young woman behind the screen.

All of them struggle getting actual relationships, though.

mdf676 · 2024-10-22T03:34:43+00:00

No, I have several woman friends who are far less conventionally attractive than me, but have wayyyyyyyy more romantic and sexual opportunities. My friend who’s a 60 year old, overweight black woman has 1,000 Tinder likes and hooks up with a new, attractive 20-something guy every week. It’s not even close to the experience even of an average looking guy.

InkAddict718 · 2024-10-22T04:16:48+00:00

Wrong. Conventionally unattractive women get sex and relationships. My best female friend was hovering around 300 lbs at her heaviest and still got attention.

Conventionally unattractive woman =\= conventionally unattractive man. The male equivalent is ignored. Your female privilege is showing

Main_Following1881 · 2024-10-22T06:16:34+00:00

Women in general have higher standards than men and are less desperate for a relationship. Unironically if all men had their libido cut in half the dating market would be alot more fair.

BearSpray007 · 2024-10-22T10:20:36+00:00

Yeah not true at all. Haven’t they done surveys that disprove this? Women rate like 80% of men as unattractive or below average. Yet you consistently see average or below average women, even unattractive and obese women getting disproportionate amounts of attention from men.

What I HAVE seen is women who are below average in terms of attractiveness AND who are poor at sexual signaling (frumpy appearance, poor posture, unappealing dress, unkempt appearance, no makeup, etc) being ignored by men (sometimes), but that comes down largely to things a woman can control.

fundamentally_comfy · 2024-10-22T12:42:25+00:00

Every mid-uggo woman I've known has had a boyfriend or been in a relationship. If a woman grows into a spinster its usually by choice. The same cant be said about mid-uggo men. Also any woman can just get on Tindr and bathe in options unlike men. ALSO your post seems to assume that ugly/fat men don't get bullied or mean comments, but they do.

OscarTheHusky · 2024-10-22T12:45:49+00:00

This is false, even conventionally unattractive women have it easier than average looking guys and everybody knows that.

SomeSugondeseGuy · 2024-10-22T01:23:55+00:00

Let's be completely honest for a second - nobody has it easy in the dating world. There are people who have it better than others (namely young, attractive women), but that does not mean it isn't without risks or struggles.

You're completely right though - people don't consider the experiences of conventionally unattractive people, and that includes conventionally unattractive women

As true as this is, conventionally unattractive women are still privileged in dating compared to similarly unattractive men.

Icy_Version_8693 · 2024-10-22T09:47:55+00:00

I think you're crazy, a below avg woman can still get laid, a below avg man is in an almost hopeless situation.

Jello_Vivid · 2024-10-22T04:41:13+00:00

I still think she will get more attention than the ugly guy who is most likely invisible so that is the reason why men think females have privilege when dating because it's clear the average woman has many more options than the average man when comparing at roughly the same level.

Woomandatory · 2024-10-22T04:52:43+00:00

Physical attraction is non negotiable

jha_avi · 2024-10-22T06:22:43+00:00

even conventionally attractive women get rejected sometimes

By conventionally attractive guys i would assume.

QuantityAcademic · 2024-10-22T06:29:53+00:00

Where I'm from, even conventionally unattractive women get a thousand plus matches on dating apps. So I disagree.

Artistic_Speech_1965 · 2024-10-22T08:04:04+00:00

True story, the dating market is all about attractiveness. If you're attractive enough, you win. I know that stars invest an immense amount of money to their beauty (products, physical activity, specialist, diet, surgery, etc.). Technically a lot of people can become really attractive if they invest a lot on they attractiveness

ChemistryFederal6387 · 2024-10-22T16:15:53+00:00

I haven't met one women who has struggled to date, not one.

So unless I have spent my life surrounded by lingerie models, the op is talking non-sense.

Joe6p · 2024-10-22T19:27:45+00:00

Personally I don't mention onlyfans for just the reason you mention. But I mean that most women can get paid for sex work at a higher rate than men. And that option is always in their back pocket because the demand is so high.

Oli_love90 · 2024-10-23T02:34:28+00:00

Everytime this topic I brought up, I find the replies from guys so fascinating. This is absolutely true, but ya’ll bend over backwards with invalid points to disprove lived experiences.

Seems like the empathy guys want from women is not something they’re willing to give to women who are struggling.

Williver · 2024-10-22T06:20:38+00:00

"It seems like a lot of men don't even count conventionally unattractive women as women sometimes"

i need some examples of "conventionally unattractive".

SOwED · 2024-10-22T07:41:27+00:00

I don't think all women have it easier.

I think it goes like this as far as ease in both dating and life in general:

Hot women>hot men>the rest of women who aren't unattractive>the rest of men who aren't unattractive>the rest of men>the rest of women

forking_guy · 2024-10-22T12:19:43+00:00

I'm just saying; ALL of the ugliest women I know have been able to get laid AND even find a boyfriend at some point in their lives. I can't say that about most of the unattractive men I know.

KGmagic52 · 2024-10-22T13:01:56+00:00

Have they tried working on their personality? Maybe get some more interesting hobbies? Work on their social skills and learn to approach? If they haven't done these, then they are just being entitled. Nobody owes them dates.

giveuporfindaway · 2024-10-22T01:44:47+00:00

Sum is easy, by any definition, compared to zero.

The dating market is zero sum for men.

The dating market for women is sum sum.

Trouvette · 2024-10-22T04:54:44+00:00

Can confirm. Before I lost weight, I did not exist as a potential partner. I had so many guy friends, but I was always treated like one of the boys. I never had a man offer to buy me a drink, ask for my number, ask me out, flirt with me. None of it at all. Even after I lost the weight, these things didn’t happen because I have severe RBF. I had to be the one to take the initiative and ask guys out. I can’t even conceive of the level of attention that gets routinely discussed here.

FreitasAlan · 2024-10-22T06:48:32+00:00

That's true. But they also find 50% of women to be >5/10.

2024-10-22T10:15:17+00:00

Sure, some women have it rough in dating, but let’s not act like it’s the same for men. For guys, especially those who aren’t conventionally attractive, the issue is usually complete invisibility. On dating apps, most men struggle just to get noticed, let alone matched. Meanwhile, even women who aren’t ‘conventionally attractive’ still get attention—negative or otherwise.

You mention your friend being bullied or treated poorly, and that’s awful. But when men talk about dating being easier for women, they’re talking about how women, in general, at least get noticed. Men who aren’t considered attractive often feel like they don’t even exist in the dating world.

So yeah, dating isn’t perfect for anyone, but pretending it’s the same struggle for both genders misses the point. The reality is men are often invisible, and that’s a whole different level of difficulty.

Shoddy_Count8248 · 2024-10-22T15:50:45+00:00

YES.

Shoddy_Count8248 · 2024-10-22T16:46:07+00:00

To all the guys saying “well at least the woman gets sex.”

Women DO NOT look at sex the same way as men. It is not validating to have a person who would fuck anything fuck you. Unless you think fucking a prostitute is validating? But there is a fuck ton of guys who say it isn’t.

You think it’s better to be with someone who destroys your self esteem than to be alone, you’ve got problems.

You CAN’T say “men will fuck anything” and then complain when women tell you that sex with men isn’t some privilege. Wow this guy will fuck anything! I must be so super special that he wants to fuck me 🤣🤣🤣

Being fucked by men who wouldn’t be seen with you in public? Being fucked by men who don’t worry about your pleasure so it isn’t even pleasurable? Yah then it’s gross, painful, and exposes you to all sorts of risks. It is a massive blow to your self esteem.

You dudes will NEVER understand women until you recognize that your dick isn’t some great prize to a woman. Jesus fucking Christ.

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Glass-Violinist-8352 · 2024-10-22T17:57:32+00:00

Yeah it could be true, the difference is that while men see 20% of women as very unattractive women see 80% of men as very unattractive lol

jhunter2015 · 2024-10-22T19:08:32+00:00

I’ve literally settled for obese chicks at one point in my life. Even a morbidly obese chick that lives in the middle of nowhere can have a better dating life than the average man.

She can use dating apps to eventually find someone. I’ve seen a female tinder experiment where they literally made the girl ugly on purpose, and she still got hundreds of matches.

I’ve seen obese woman’s profiles, last girl I talked to had like 600 matches in total.

jhunter2015 · 2024-10-22T19:18:35+00:00

As a an average man that’s been with unattractive women I can assure you their dating lives are 10x better .

It’s mostly unattractive women on the apps in the first place , putting up old pictures when they were thin. I saw obese chicks with 600+ matches.

Yes dating is slightly harder for unattractive women but only because they always shoot too high. You literally see TikToks of fat chicks crying that the 6’5 finance bro didn’t smile at them😂😂.

LostWanderer88 · 2024-10-22T22:11:58+00:00

I don't ignore 5/10 and above

Some 4/10 could even pass if their charisma is gold

Disastrous-Chart-928 · 2024-10-22T23:40:28+00:00

Na, disagree. Back when I lived in the west, Ireland specifically I'd see bronzed up girls of the ... rounder variety with perfectly decent looking tall guys that were in shape.

I hate this word, but hypergamy was very apparent. I'm going to assume feminism and dating apps were to blame?

Reasonable-Cookie783 · 2024-10-23T02:02:58+00:00

These women are on the dating apps swiping on Chad just like every other woman. Women almost never acknowledge there actual attractiveness level. There was a study where women rated themselves 7 on average. What a wonderful world it would be if that was true. There are tons of 5'4 170 lb sevens walking around lol. That's the average height and weight of the average American women what's that a size 14 ?

whenthedont · 2024-10-23T10:41:35+00:00

Not true. Speaking as guy

Middle-Effort7495 · 2024-10-23T11:18:49+00:00

The vast majoriy of men rate the vast majority of women as attractive enough.

Hell, lookup Pig Girl experiment. Show me a, "conventionally unttractive woman" that can't get thousands of men in her DMs.

Conventionally unattractive women don't have issues dating men. They have issues dating the same 10-20% of men that have plenty of options, and diregard the 5000 guys in their DMs.

If you're a woman, looks are never your problem. It is your standards, expectations, or your personality.

Basic-Parfait3122 · 2024-10-25T13:23:17+00:00

Nonsense. Dating app data says otherwise.

Aysak3 · 2024-10-25T19:43:17+00:00

I dont know why its so hard for women to understand that even ugly women have it better than ugly men. Yeah sure you are in a worst position compared to beautiful men but thats like 20% of them. In reality it goes like: Beautiful women > beautiful men > ugly women > ugly men.

NeatEngineer5623 · 2024-10-22T10:43:52+00:00

Not to mention that getting used for sex (vs. just getting rejected immediately) isn't really better for most women, even if they aren't explicitly rejected.

At least they get the experience of having a few hookups and a bit of spicy fun which is what men are looking for too.

You speak as if unattractive women have it tough which isn't the case, they just have it slightly harder than attractive ones. Fact of the matter is you would have to be really low down on the rating of looks in order to feel the true out casting feeling that a slightly under average man gets who is either down on his looks or not being tall enough and I am talking like someone such as Martha Dunnstock character in the movie Heathers. If you want to use unattractive women in comparison to how bad men have it just remember that those type of women are known to have high standards and still get the opportunity to reject men all the while short and underaverage men don't even make it as far as even rejecting anyone as nobody even looks their way. So what does that tell you? But being under average for women they have it on the slightly above easy mode because all they have to do is sit there and they could await for someone to approach them. If they were feeling insecure about their looks then other women and men would even come together and tell her how she has nothing to really worry about whereas men who worry about this stuff are immediately told to change everything such as losing weight and changing his hair style which is proof in itself that women only want them if they conform to their ideology of what makes Mr. Right.

Title	Men ignore conventionally unattractive women (they aren't even on their radar), so they assume that all women are privileged in dating
Author	Blonde_Icon
Upvotes	116
Comments	483
Date	October 22, 2024 1:04 AM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1g9620r/men_ignore_conventionally_unattractive_women_they/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/men-ignore-conventionally-unattractive-women-they.1533039 https://theredarchive.com/post/1533039

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