There is nothing wrong with not being selected by women

BearSpray007 · 2024-09-30T16:48:00+00:00

While there’s a certain logic to these sentiments, it also seems to be a fact that while some men will NOT get chosen, a fully functioning society henges on the even unchosen men’s belief that they can/will be chosen at some point.

There have been studies where in polygamous societies where a few wealthy men are able to have many wives and too many regular men aren’t able to secure access to wives those men rebel, or as we see in our modern western society men begin giving up and turning away from women/marriage “traditional masculinity” and being generally productive members of society.

It seems sex/marriage/legacy is the main way to get men at large to buy into society. After all why would men care about contributing to a project that they nor their progeny will reap the benefits of?

IceWingAngel · 2024-09-30T15:53:31+00:00

Agree with the title, but I doubt society as a collective will ever perceive it this way. Disagree with some of the substances since plenty of "unworthy" men and women go on to reproduce and by that I mean those that are not fit to be parents, but that kind of branches off into a whole 'nother discussion entirely. Lastly, much like the negative perception will never fade, you will also just as equally never get the non-selectees to advocate for what essentially sounds like pro-eugenics.

MeteorMash101 · 2024-09-30T19:24:17+00:00

I'm literally in the top 10% of earners, and I've never had a gf haha.

Money don't matter as much as people think. Only looks and/or perceived social status. But from my anecdotal POV, 80%+ is looks-based. Mother nature is indeed cruel, and unfair at times.

Major_Decision_7107 · 2024-09-30T16:02:31+00:00

This is the idea of biological determinism and human nature. While we have evolved, we remain influenced by our instincts. It’s a complicated position: we can recognize our emotions and moral understanding, yet still feel frustration over circumstances beyond our control. Although we’re no longer purely driven by animal instincts, we comprehend the significance of consent and the consequences of our actions in relationships, acknowledging that we can’t access intimacy forcefully.

Quirrelwasachad · 2024-10-01T03:45:01+00:00

Disagree. True natural selection would be short women/women with hereditary disabilities/mental disorders like autism/low iq women not reproducing.

As long as these women reproduce, you're not advocating for natural selection. You're advocating for hypergamy.

Sander_Supporter · 2024-09-30T20:28:03+00:00

Ah yes, the classic bluepill “You must be happy with the shit hand you have been dealt, and if you’re not, you’re a misogynist”

_CuntfinderGeneral · 2024-09-30T15:57:47+00:00

Yeah there is, it fucking sucks ass dude

purplish_possum · 2024-10-01T04:05:23+00:00

men don't meet the legitimate requirements of women

LOL!!! As if female vetting is rational.

NataliaCaptions · 2024-09-30T20:24:39+00:00

The problem with "natural selection" is that it's actually "sexual selection"

Women don't select traits that are beneficial for the species like intelligence, empathy, they select traits like height or dark triad personalities

I'm not saying we ought ot do anything but "natural selection" isn't necessarily morally right.

yusuf1029 · 2024-09-30T18:02:52+00:00

Female hypergamy is a constant with no limit. Removing undesirable men from the gene pool will not create "better" males in the future that women are more attracted to. They will always be selective and want the top 10% of men. Doesn't matter if most men are tall supermodels with loads of money.

The issue is that a system has been created in which this entitlement is fostered. There are laws that give nice jobs exclusively to women and force schools to enroll a certain number of women in order to get money or not be shut down. Divorce and family court heavily favor women. Basically, the state has largely replaced the role of men and interferes between men and women to prop women above men. This is very evident in parts of Asia and the entire Western world.

You're suggesting that the forces at play here are just natural selection when in reality it is very artifical. As we can see across the West, birth rates are plummeting and as a result more patriarchal non-feminist cultures are streaming in to replace those Western cultures which have been rotted by feminism and liberalism.

So, in the context of wanting a culture and people to survive, there is absolutely something wrong with encouraging this hypergamous nature of women with a feminist gynocratic government.

Cultural-Ad-8486 · 2024-09-30T18:16:41+00:00

This post is certainly interesting, but there is one problem.... Natural selection does not work nearly as shitty and terrible for men as you describe. So, natural selection is not something reasonable and does not work so clearly and successfully to select only amazing features and filter out the unnecessary, and often the opposite happens. Our ancestors reproduced quite well, both men and women in large numbers and almost all. And even without violence and coercion.

Most men and women around the world are average in appearance, character, wealth, etc. And it has always been so, throughout history, at least for our biological species specifically.

The problems with dating that we have now are largely problems not because "men are terrible" or "women are terrible", but only because we are simply not used to as a human species to dealing with such huge flows of information and connections between us.

We are used to interacting in groups of our own kind in tens or at most hundreds of people. Not in thousands, hundreds of thousands and millions constantly, especially taking into account social networks.

For most of our history, literally hundreds of thousands of years, we lived in small groups and did not have any special social problems. And the society in which we live has existed for a very short time and began to form only after the Bronze Age, which is simply an insignificant amount of time.

So the whole problem with dating is generally artificial and unnatural for us and trying to justify it by natural selection is wrong

Cool_Ranch_2511 · 2024-09-30T18:58:28+00:00

Do we all want a return to cold, brutal darwinism for women too? or is that just for the men in this society

As long as we do everything according to nature, then ok. Women will pick the strongest men however they can, and men will regain a massivly unfair imbalance of power in the political and economic realm. What I don't understand is why we need to even the playing field for women. But it's always full throttle evolutionary pressure, survival of the fittest type shit for men.

Cunnin_Linguists · 2024-09-30T20:43:43+00:00

"Nothing wrong with not being selected by women"

Women: insulting men based on if they get women or not

😂

DumbWordsmith · 2024-09-30T16:44:41+00:00

In the end the process of natural selection must unfold free from any kind of interference

We humans built thriving societies by putting a damper on many of our "natural" instincts and separating ourselves from the dangers presented by our "natural" environment and predators.

As long as men and women are forced (through coercion) to financially support the poor choices of other men and women, they should have a say.

Being angry about any of this is dumb IMO, but when it comes to the average person's mating choices (and behavior), there's plenty of foolishness to criticize, especially considering that everyone else is forced to subsidize them.

No-Consequence-6513 · 2024-09-30T16:49:24+00:00

Yeah yeah. Men's problems are natural, women's problems are societal. Misandry and hypocrisy as always.

Redpill-mind · 2024-09-30T15:59:15+00:00

One might call this a naturalistic fallacy but ok

Naebany · 2024-09-30T19:02:00+00:00

There might not be anything shameful about not being chosen but you can't blame them for being mad about it. Redpillers try to work the system, becoming more attractive and being chosen while blackpillers just give up.

I don't think it's reasonable to ask people who are not chosen to be cool with that system and advocate for something that is not in their favor. They want to change it so it suits them. That's also nature. You want reality to be what benefits you, not others.

Wanderingwombat1902 · 2024-09-30T23:20:13+00:00

This is an absolutely awful, half baked idea of a post.

First, this implies that people having the most kids are the most “fit.” That reeks of social Darwinism. And how would you define most fit?

Also, look at countries that have the highest birth rates? Are the men in Mali just more fit than other men because they have more kids?

As a western man, I could walk into any number of 3rd world countries and have a wife in 24 hours or less, and then have a massive family with her. If you’re rich enough to could pay a surrogate mother to have your children without ever being married - like Cristiano Ronaldo did.

The idea that western women are the arbiters of human evolution is laughable and ridiculous and straight up untrue.

This is honestly embarrassing that anyone would think this way.

UpstairsAd1235 · 2024-09-30T23:43:38+00:00

ensure that only worthy men reproduce their genes.

^ Interesting language you are using here. This is what causes red pill rage.

In the end the process of natural selection must unfold free from any kind of interference or obstruction from reactionary, misogynistic forces therefore I think all men, chosen or unchosen, should advocate for the education, liberation and empowerment of women to ensure natural selection.

^ Ok. Now, I just know you just hate men LMAO.

abaxeron · 2024-10-01T00:21:34+00:00

Women get pregnant so they have a higher burden to reproduction.

In developed countries, more men die supporting their families than women supporting their families AND giving birth combined. "There were 5,486 fatal work injuries recorded in the United States in 2022... Women made up 8.1 percent (445 [cases])... In 2022, 817 women died of maternal causes in the United States" Women, maternal causes + fatal work injuries == 1262. Men, all fatal work injuries - women == 5041. Almost exactly 4 dead men per dead woman.

This increased risk means they must be picky when selecting men so to ensure that only worthy men reproduce their genes.

Okay, when will they start? xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

This means that some men don't meet the legitimate requirements of women and will never experience what it's like to have intercourse with a woman or even relationships.

Yes. And the world gets more accomodating to them with every passing day. Have you seen what modern sex toys can do.

In the end the process of natural selection must unfold free from any kind of interference or obstruction from reactionary, misogynistic forces therefore I think all men, chosen or unchosen, should advocate for the education, liberation and empowerment of women to ensure natural selection.

"Empowering women is the most effective way to reduce fertility rates and achieve a sustainable population size that respects the limits of Earth's carrying capacity. The number of years a woman has spent in education is usually inversely correlated with the number of children she will bear in her lifetime." xxxxxx

Your proposal will not make women "naturally select" better men for reproduction; it will make women select no-one at all.

purplish_possum · 2024-10-01T04:09:28+00:00

Inequality breeds resentment which in turn breeds anger with can be redirected in ways which endanger civil society. The fact that frustrated young men are attracted to MAGA and Trump's empty rantings being a current example.

LordShadows · 2024-10-01T09:31:54+00:00

It's not about being wrong or right.

It's about needs not being met and life purpose.

Many men have been raised with funding a family as the purpose of their life and romantic and sexual success as equating their values as individuals.

Even without this, men natural needs in terms of sexuality and affection aren't met outside of relationships.

So what happens when your needs aren't met, your self-esteem is crushed by your lack of success, and your life purpose is unattainable?

You either kill yourself or start revolting against the world.

It's easy to say "men should..." but the reality doesn't always fit the ideal.

Right now their is a suicide epidemic among men, while many others are antagonising the current status quod.

The more we ignore the issues, the more we leave men to deal with it alone, the more problems will appear.

Extremist organisations directly target men feeling lost and isolated for recruitments.

They know it's the most vulnerable population. The one who is searching for a feeling of community, for a life purpose, and the one who is feeling the most antagonised by society.

Ignoring issues a part of the population is facing is exactly what is destabilising society and weakening its resistance to malicious influences.

KamuiObito · 2024-09-30T16:38:12+00:00

While some abusive narcissist sociopath is getting pussy every night. As long as those men exist in relationships ill always feel slightly worse missing out. Drama is a dopamine thing for them.

Dertross · 2024-09-30T19:00:14+00:00

Redpillers and blackpillers should respect the sexual preferences of women instead of getting angry at them for not being picked.

What's with this false dichotomy

I resent women for not picking me. I don't respect them for it at all. It's not respectable for women to not pick me while they are picking drug dealers, deadbeats, and other criminals.

I believe women should have the right to not pick me.

This isn't a contradiction.

There is nothing shameful about being unchosen by women since that's just how mother nature does her work.

Human civilization is about getting humans out from under the thumb of nature for the benefit of humankind. "But it is nature!" is literally a fallacy.

nightcall379 · 2024-09-30T16:09:02+00:00

Redpillers and blackpillers should respect the sexual preferences of women instead of getting angry at them for not being picked.

The problem the red, and the black pillers are expressing isn't in women not picking them

It's in women concealing what they're actually attracted to

Shoddy_Count8248 · 2024-09-30T17:37:11+00:00

Agreed.

And there have been many many people - men and women - who have made amazing advancements to humankind without kids. Tesla and Newton come to mind.

DankuTwo · 2024-09-30T20:16:16+00:00

Yeah, there's nothing wrong with starving to death, either!

Food, shelter, community, and procreation are the absolute cornerstones of life. Being denied 1 or 2 of them is not, and should not be, pleasant.

RelativeYak7 · 2024-09-30T16:29:09+00:00

This is just a defense of the naturalistic fallacy. Cancer and asbestos are also natural and we can be angry, try to cure it etc.

Freethinker312 · 2024-09-30T16:01:51+00:00

Women get pregnant so they have a higher burden to reproduction. This increased risk means they must be picky when selecting men

Not everything some women select for minimalizes their risks.

I think it is wrong to shame men who don't get selected by women because being unchosen is a consequence of natural selection that we all must accept.

They indeed shouldn't be shamed for it. It's not (just) because of natural selection though. Some women make bad choices with regards to men, some women have insane standards, and sometimes people (men and women) just have bad luck.

Circle_of_Steel_ · 2024-09-30T17:21:46+00:00

Look at all the women who blast evo-psych and red pill and how much of a fraud it is come on here with their eugenics talk about how women should only want to mate with the most "fit and strong" essentially proving both hypergamy and how women's sexuality and nature is something I guess women just are too animalistic and simple minded to overcome, chock full of appeal to nature and naturalistic fallacies, only when it suits them of course. Followed up by the good old "wHat dO yOu wAnT uS tO dO, sLeEp wItH mEn wE aReN't AtTrAcTeD tO?" with a spattering of what amounts to "get good bro to become attractive and get the womenz lol". It amounts to hypocrisy, They hate the red pill and manosphere because isn't overwhelmingly generous in its interpretation to women, while basically not even disagreeing with it. Most of the women here are walking contradictions and just hate men in general and they can't hide it no matter how hard they try. Oh yeah, and before anyone comments, I couldn't give a fuck less if you are celibate or only fuck chads, I just don't care, before that is unironically tried on this comment as well. It is their favorite tactic to use to shut down any debate after all.

Luckily most women aren't this simple minded and aren't always droning on about how 95% of women would've been single in the past because she couldn't lock down chad but didn't have a choice so she (oh the HUMANITY) had to suffer having her body used as a sex toy and birthing kids she loathed. Do you see how ridiculous and dramatic the women are on this sub? Most of them are very weird and not normal women, just as they like to say about they guys on this sub. These are the type of women you stay away from and would be better off being single than with because they *will* make your life a living hell. They are plain insufferable. There are some women who actually come here to debate in good faith and it is enjoyable to talk to them, but most are on here to troll.

Edit:

Oh yeah, forgot to mention, I haven't once got an answer to this, if its just natural and good that women chase only 5% of the most fit men to have sex and reproduce with, why wouldn't males employing the sexual strategies what is seen in other animals species not natural? They can't answer that. If they answer "becuz we live in a society and know good from wrong" why is it just presumed women aren't actively harming society by only chasing the top guys, and why is that good? Many of the women here say they'd rather society collapse than dating someone on even the same attraction level as them because they will only settle for a HVM. That would actively make women "wrong" in the eyes of what is good for the continuation of a society. So you either use your naturalistic point for men AND women, or neither, otherwise you are a hypocrite and your argument can easily be dismissed.

nightcall379 · 2024-09-30T16:12:49+00:00

In the end the process of natural selection must unfold free from any kind of interference or obstruction from reactionary, misogynistic forces

You just said "it must", but didn't explain "why" it must

No-Operation5651 · 2024-09-30T20:10:33+00:00

Agree with the title, Disagree with the body of the text. Humans are an intersexual selection species, which means it should be the male, by competing, that chooses the mate. Females are (should be) passive and mate the winners, like happens with most mammals.

MysterySolverDog · 2024-09-30T21:32:03+00:00

Using arguments about the modern age that rely on natural selection is inherently fallacious. "Mother nature" also does her work by killing off the unfit - it therefore holds that anyone who has had their life saved by modern medicine should be castrated as in a state of nature they would not be able to reproduce.

Another problem of looking at the world through the lens of natural selection is that it inherently justifies murder, as the victim wasnt strong enough to successfully defend against their attacker. In fact, might always makes right and you can justify any crime by virtue of being able to commit it. I could easily change the last paragraph in your post to read as "In the end the process of natural selection must unfold free from any kind of interference or obstruction from legal or medical forces therefore I think everyone should advocate for the abolition of all laws and medical treatment to ensure natural selection", and it would be completely logically consistent with the rest of your post.

So, you can be logically consistent and live in a Mad Max society (except worse) while celebrating about how hard you shut down the inkwells. Alternatively, you can choose to live in civilization with the rest of us and realize that changing beauty standards for women is something that has already been done and it is completely logically consistent to expect men to be included too. Greater social inclusion of men, greater awareness of male mental health, and societal efforts towards combatting the male loneliness epidemic are all completely reasonable asks, as an example the Japanese government has already made substantual efforts to try and raise birth rates. Unfortunately, part of the social contract is that you don't get to tell people to just get lost if they have a problem you've judged you're unlikely to suffer from.

ExternalBarracuda292 · 2024-10-01T06:58:57+00:00

According to the CDC, <1.5% of men are virgins by age 40, which suggests that few if any men are so undesirable as to never have any prospects in their lifetime (keep in mind this value would also include people who abstain from sex by choice). Even those who are legitimately bottom 1% can probably escape that range via self improvement, since they only have to be better than 1 out of every 50 men to be safely outside the danger zone.

Of course, finding a successful relationship is harder, but that's never what people are talking about when they discuss this kind of thing. Also, single people are so common that it's become totally destigmatized.

Feisty_Response_9401 · 2024-10-01T12:55:18+00:00

In theory, no, just as there is nothing wrong with women not being desirable or not being able to have kids.

But social pressures and expectations are always there, and relationships are a door to a wider range of experiences that people may want.

Specs400 · 2024-10-01T14:03:47+00:00

Late to the party and it's likely been said, but while there's nothing ingerently wrong or shameful about not being chosen, there is something shameful about wanting to be chosen but adopting an obsequious posture of acceptance of biological determinism.

Lovers691 · 2024-09-30T18:39:54+00:00

You just described in the content of your post the thing that is wrong with not being selected by women which is that it marks you as a genetic reject meaning by virtue of your birth you are inferior to those who were selected for mating

Plazmatron44 · 2024-09-30T17:37:00+00:00

"There's nothing wrong with being poor, you just don't meet legitimate requirements, if you don't like being poor then just be less poor."

AcephalicDude · 2024-09-30T16:03:52+00:00

Personally, I find these evo-psych theories to be very silly. Human beings are not animals. We have a great degree of control over our instincts and our desires are complex, intellectually and emotionally. Both men and women have complicated preferences when it comes to dating and relationships.

But ultimately, yes, I agree, nobody should feel ashamed for being rejected. Compatibility is what really matters, and sometimes you just aren't going to be compatible with the person you want.

horrible_opinions · 2024-09-30T15:48:04+00:00

this topic must always come with the caveat that, while women do control natural selection, it's completely possible that they collectively select extremely poorly and drive the species into the ground. not saying that's what's happening, just that "women select" doesn't mean you should put women on a pedestal

in modern times it's also more possible than ever to lead an exciting and rich life but still get no pussy. in 2004 you could reasonably predict that an adult virgin was a semi-autistic obese unemployed basement dweller, but now he could be making six figs and an avid hiker in foreign countries (but he's 5'8)

DPHAngel · 2024-09-30T18:48:46+00:00

Fair enough

codgas · 2024-09-30T23:43:43+00:00

You're seeing this through the wrong point of view. Men will check out of society if they have nothing to gain from it. Does society want to at best loose part of its men? At worst create a group of men that are antagonistic to it?

I'd argue that men are the back bone of society so no, it can't loose them. Maybe it can loose a few, but if you keep removing pieces the whole thing is gonna collapse at some point.

Junius-Julius · 2024-10-01T02:15:01+00:00

I kinda agree with you but...

Society won't accept this. A great deal of your (moral) value as a man is measured trough your capabilty to attract women.

I'm a lonely dude and I know that doesn't mean I'm a bad person. This truth doesn't make my great desire to emotional and sexual connection with the opposite gender fades away.

Union_9_Link · 2024-10-01T05:20:49+00:00

I don't think men are angry for not being selected. Some may be angry because they're lied to, but the majority understands the fact and they don't want themself and fellow brothers being taken advantage of.

throwaway_alt_slo · 2024-10-01T06:48:05+00:00

This is too high IQ post for his sub

Mountain-Jicama-3207 · 2024-09-30T15:54:34+00:00

I mean I know men and women who walk by there husband/ wife daily. Alot of people tend to make bad choices and pick what they like versus what actually works for them. I can understand the men being angry but you can't force the women too choose them due too the fact it's still a gamble either way.

If your going to gamble on a long term realtionship at least make it something you would personally would prefer.

Schwloeb · 2024-09-30T20:12:21+00:00

At first glance this is a reasonable take on the subject.

But there is another side. Men are also biologically programmed to reproduce and to want to reproduce. Why else are we dragging our cocks and balls along everday? And why else do we feel lust when we see a virile, fertile, healthy looking female specimen?

And it is this want, or should I say 'need' for reproduction, which is the driving force for the male ambition. The desire to rise to the top, to become the best version of ourselves. To be creative. To develop skills. Humor. To make other people laugh. Hell, I would even argue it is the sole reason to get out of bed. Subconsciously of course. But it is there, the hidden driving force behind the will to live.

And so, if a man does all the above and becomes a succesful man, capable of supporting himself and others. Developed a sense of humor. Expanded his knowledge and his wit. And basically, does everything 'right'. But then is rejected by virtually all females in his surroundings. Then there is only one conclusion to be made: He failed. He is a failure. And yes, this sucks. Of course it does.

It doesn't matter if it's natural or not. It does not matter if our 'species' as a whole might benefit from it. For this person, this is a nightmare.

It is like a new smartphone that went into production, got all the internal components ready and assemblied, but nobody buys it. Because it's too small. Or too smooth. Or people don't like its software. So it's just sitting there on the shelf. Expiring everyday. Because it keeps getting older, and newer phones are released every day. If nobody buys it in it's 'prime', most probably nobody ever will.

So the phone slowly dies, sitting in the shop on a shelf. Nobody has ever called anyone with it. Nobody has ever browsed a porn site on it. It just sits there collecting dust until someone throws it in the bin.

Maybe it was for the better, for the smartphone market as a whole. We have enough brands and choice as it is. With better specs and more streamlined software. But still. That phone was a useless waste of energy and resources. And it didn't even have fun.

(I am not a virgin and I have a wife and kids, but I do have enough empathy to be able to imagine how it must feel to be sexually unselected for most or whole of our life)

Pathosgrim · 2024-09-30T22:34:09+00:00

There's going to be alot more of you in the future. "They" want men to acquiesce just as you have done. I respect you're willing to bow out to avoid the bs but at the same time, you should have a little shred of hope within you somewhere.

ChromeBadge · 2024-09-30T15:58:25+00:00

Women in developed countries don't need to select anything, anymore.

This is a paradigm shift and unfortunately like the internet rather than bringing peace, understanding and enlightenment we humans got completely lost in our reptile brains and created porn culture.

Not just sexual porn but everything is a gross exaggeration of reality and unfortunately one aspect of that exaggeration is a false sense of superiority.

Bakenredemption · 2024-09-30T20:15:34+00:00

NO , respectfully F*ck off with this energy. Yeah , men should be happy being lonely cûvks while the desirable men get all the 🐱. NO.

haaku-san · 2024-09-30T16:55:42+00:00

bro, i say who cares about being selected by women? you're just being selected to get wrecked later down the line or to get cheated on. it happens to everyone imo.

just see a "professional" for your needs and move on with your life. it's what i do and it's miles better than dating and marriage. it's all for sale imo. dating is just a more complicated and worse version of it.

these red pilled and black pilled dudes will feel so much better if they pay 2 play like i do. people that i know irl are getting cheated on, getting into arguments, dealing with shitty relationships. that's what you're missing out on if you don't get selected.

i'm banging hot asian chicks with no strings attached and no stupid games. i have this shit figured out. humans are insane. good luck finding love from the species that drop nukes on each other, and fight each other every day. get real.

Blitted_Master · 2024-09-30T17:42:00+00:00

Society needs to make sense for the participants in order to function properly. Sex is a major reason men strive to succeed in life. Without the possibility for the carrot the horse won’t run.

The old, beta-friendly setup of monogamy for most worked well enough. We are moving now towards extreme mass-hypergamy meaning a smaller number of men will be deemed worthy of obtaining sex/a woman. This model will absolutely ensure societal collapse, short of a game-changing course correction taking place via technological advancements (like robot girlfriends, for instance).

When WW3 breaks out, I predict many (if not most) men will allow society to collapse and won’t fight. The true enemies are within.

TallFoundation7635 · 2024-09-30T18:42:13+00:00

Redpillers are not blaming women for not choosing them, they are blaming women for their hypocrisy and lies which leads to men having very little romantic success.

Redpillers are also angry that women en masse are making false reports about people or communities that discuss this. The Redpill subreddit has been quarantined, the twoxchromosomes sub is alive and ticking.

In other words, they are lying and silencing voices of dissent that disagree with their viewpoints, but luckily reality will continue to be reality and more and more people are starting to wake up to it.

Nihi1986 · 2024-09-30T17:47:41+00:00

Dude...at times of my life where I have been useless I have been 'chosen' by some women (though I didn't want to reproduce), at times when I have been my best version they have gone for the genetically gifted asshole who looks like he has a really bad addiction to hard drugs.

The fat naive motherfucker who inherited properties and a job at dad's company is not the 'worthy' or who mother nature has chosen to reproduce.

'Reactionary mysogynistic forces'...so if I want them to chose better (not necessarily me, just fucking chose better) that makes me a reactionary mysogynist and not someone who would like society to improve for a brighter future...?

If I go back to my last ex who wanted (and likely still wants) to be a mother before she starts fucking someone else would that mean that I have been chosen by nature to be a worthy sperm donor...?

I do not fully respect the sexual preferences of extremely low IQ individuals, be it women or men. I don't have to.

peachyyarngoddess · 2024-09-30T17:25:44+00:00

Also don’t forget, if a man or woman is in a relationship with somebody that they don’t feel like is the right fit for them, they build resentment. Looking back, I’ve resented a lot of men because I didn’t want to be with them or I’d try to give them a chance but they didn’t meet a standard for how I felt like I should be treated or the life I wanted, and I know some of those guys resented me for various reasons including that I didn’t like being abused by them so I began to resent them.

Plus-Opportunity8541 · 2024-09-30T18:15:01+00:00

No one is angry that women aren't picking them. They're angry that society tells them to do X, they do X, and nothing good happens for them. "Go to college" "Be kind and respectful" "Just be yourself" all things society tells young men, yet they don't get the results they've been promised. They're angry that they see a small percent of men getting all the attention. They're angry that, as they get into their 30s with more money and status and stability, all of a sudden the women who got ran through by all those guys in their 20s just want a stable man, and they pick this guy. Young men are angry because it feels unfair that they have to literally wait to get into a relationship while women get to be as promiscuous and have as much fun as they want, and that leads to a lot of men just nope-ing out of the dating pool. It just doesn't seem fair to men 18-29, who are now the generation with the lowest rate of relationships in their 20s in recorded history.

Ok-Party8338 · 2024-09-30T15:44:26+00:00

We are evolved to survive and reproduce, unable to do so makes you a genetic dead end and a failure.

WastedRadiance · 2024-09-30T15:59:26+00:00

I don’t think the majority of men who “don’t get picked” are just victims of natural selection though. There’s a significant portion of them that are undesirable to women because of their own choices, behaviors and character traits. And in those scenarios, yeah it is shameful.

punkkweight · 2024-09-30T18:51:40+00:00

In the end the process of natural selection must unfold free from any kind of interference or obstruction from reactionary, misogynistic forces therefore I think all men, chosen or unchosen, should advocate for the education, liberation and empowerment of women to ensure natural selection.

So... like hunter-gatherer societies? What pulled us up and away from nature and into civilization, was this neat social technology called "marriage". 'Unselected' men may not be as hot or strong as 'selected' men but they provide immense, undeniable utility to a functioning society. The only way to get 'unselected' men to participate is for them to have some kind of stake in it - i.e. a wife and children. A man with a wife and children will do any hard and shitty job to provide for them, and uphold society in process. 'Unselected' men that have no stake in society will be content with jerking off and playing video games while not working or providing any utility to society.(which is what we're seeing nowadays in alarming numbers).

If you want all human relationships to be reduced to prehistorical levels of hypergamy with meaningless tinder sex for the select few and Eliot Rodger resentment for the rest... so be it buddy. Between this and society, I'd choose society.

CHIN000K · 2024-09-30T16:54:58+00:00

Natural selection applies to animals living in the natural world not humans that live in cities and nation states governed by laws restricting all use of force.

LevelCaterpillar1830 · 2024-09-30T16:07:33+00:00

Sexual capitalism will lead to the destruction of society as a whole because women don't necessarily value traits that help build a society up, as opposed to what does work in terms of being attractive, which is being sharp, manly and as good-looking as possible in order to maximize her self-benefit (said self-benefit exists in opposition to what would contribute to society).

Societies aren't built on "natural selection", but in making efforts to uphold as many citizens as possible in order for them to return value back to the society that has nurtured them.

If women are off the table for most men, especially given that most men are invisible until women start physically rotting and going for the "provider types", then said collective entity called a "society" will have 0 room to complain when men stop being men and instead become parasytes and leeches.

Good luck to everyone involved to keep the lights on and keep everything going, given that men pay most of the taxes and do most of the hard-labor.

Maybe women can replace them, in terms of participation in the workforce? Hopefully, since that seems to be the only solution.

At no point were societies built on pleasantries and fancy words. They were built on efficiency. A reality that is slowly being forgotten.

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driggsky · 2024-09-30T17:12:53+00:00

I mean I agree that you can’t force people to change preferences that are hard wired (or at least very deeply ingrained)

However, as a society we do try to steer preferences and shame things that lead to bad outcomes for the rest of the population. There doesn’t exist a truly free market in this world except maybe the sexual / relationship market in western countries.

Regardless, allowing ‘natural selection to happen free from obstruction’ is faulty thinking. Natural selection is always happening. The acts of individuals to curtail the desires of women is natural selection acting. These men are fighting for their ability to reproduce. There is no such a thing as allowing natural selection to run without obstruction because natural selection is an observation on how population dynamics change over time due to the variegated fitness of the individual reproduction units (humans and related actors in our system). So your argument doesnt really make sense.

Not only that, but in general but the style of your argument is weak because we as a society form constructions and practices to mitigate risks that ‘naturally’ have occurred previously.

I agree nonetheless that the preferences of women should be respected insofar as men should not rape and shoot up things if they don’t get pussy but I disagree that people can’t complain or try to reform the system that is causing a wild social and sexual imbalance

Furthermore, our society has foundations on valuing each individual and allowing them to flourish and live a good life. It’s a little crude and shows how much empathy you lack if you think men should just accept that they shouldnt aim to have relationships or sex. Those things make life a lot better and help men be healthy.

Your argument simply boils down to bodily autonomy matters the most and free markets ought to be respected without care if the dynamics of the market cause any concern for society at large. I doubt you believe those things in general. You just want women to be able to express their preferences at the detriment of men, and that’s fine. And I notice quite often in general that when free markets favor a set of people, they love free markets. When it hurts them, they hate it. I am the same way. You are benefitting from men naturally being simps and thirsty for sex to the point where you receive tremendous benefits at the expense of men. I cant hate on you for it but it is worth calling out that if you were suffering with respect to sex or relationships, you wouldn’t have this attitude.

rustlerhuskyjeans · 2024-09-30T17:24:34+00:00

There’s just a big difference from finding a woman that lets her attraction build and guys that can hookup constantly and have harems. Most all guys aren’t proactive slayers, stuck in a more passive role.

DapperDan1929 · 2024-09-30T18:15:12+00:00

It’s easy enough to take yourself out of the game and simply remove yourself from this part of society. It’s fun! Then you do t have to even think about any of this stuff ever ever again! 😀🤘🏼

SituacijaJeSledeca · 2024-09-30T18:46:14+00:00

Agreed 100%. Also, black pillers arent angry, they are depressed and disappointed in their genetics. Red Pillers are just frustrated guys slowly converting to Black Pill. Women should be as picky as required and not give a damn what anyone thinks. That, of course, will create mini-harem situations for a lot of them (so called situationships), cheatings and such, but yeah, trade offs!

TreeSweden · 2024-09-30T18:56:59+00:00

Since we live in a modern society, it does not matter that much if you choose a partner who would find it more difficult to live in nature. Nowadays, it is rather an advantage to be able to get pregnant, have and be able to have children than to be completely without everything as a man. Pregnancies are so much safer these days in rich countries.

If it shouldn't always be about reproduction when women have sex, then it should also apply to men who are rejected by women

Teflon08191 · 2024-09-30T19:29:03+00:00

In the end the process of natural selection must unfold free from any kind of interference or obstruction

Are you sure about that? Because civilization itself is an obstruction of natural selection.

Go look at the way sharks mate if you want to see how unfettered natural selection works.

FreitasAlan · 2024-09-30T19:30:46+00:00

This assumes natural selection is fast and independent from the choices people make. It’s not. Different cultures create different incentives systems that are more or less successful. And culture comes from discussions. And discussions come from people’s motivations. People being angry and making decisions about it is part of natural selection. Telling people not to care because selection will work anyway doesn’t make sense because people caring and the way they care is part of the selection process.

Absentrando · 2024-09-30T19:31:25+00:00

This is common sense

Raii-v2 · 2024-09-30T21:20:09+00:00

As true as this may be, there’s generally always an abundance of women so it still makes it hard to justify not all men getting a (government issued) mate

Green-Quantity1032 · 2024-09-30T22:40:47+00:00

You do know natural selection includes responding properly to adversaries, right?

There's no ensuring natural selection without the pressure of the environment - that environment contains "unworthy men" - good luck.

Hunder_YT · 2024-09-30T23:03:43+00:00

So you are saying we are animals who only act on our instincts?

VWGUYWV · 2024-10-01T14:29:38+00:00

I just don’t want to jump through all the hoops required to be considered by a decent woman.

I’ve already maxed out education and make a decent living. I have hobbies and friends.

But I’m not going to make my condo attractive as a female nest. I’m not going to change how I dress or do things.

I’d rather be single and crank it to the hub a few times a week than to expend extra energy to compete for an emotional creature that, unless I’m lucky and score big via competition, will just lower my quality of life in the end. Just so I can get my penis wet periodically and also have someone to bring to social gatherings and someone that makes me more acceptable in society.

I look around and it’s like most men haven’t realized that chasing after or pining for women is optional.

ExcelsiorState718 · 2024-10-01T14:51:03+00:00

Redpillers and blackpillers should respect the sexual preferences of women instead of getting angry at them for not being picked. There is nothing shameful about being unchosen by women since that's just how mother nature does her work.

Humans arent wild animals we live in a society and take advantage of what civilization has to offer.Much of womens sexual prefferences are damaging and destructive to our society abd shouldnt be respected.

Women get pregnant so they have a higher burden to reproduction. This increased risk means they must be picky when selecting men so to ensure that only worthy men reproduce their genes.

Women pick attractive men its that simple he can br a bum serial killer drug addict pookiecor man of the year it doesnt matter

Suspicious_Glove7365 · 2024-09-30T16:11:09+00:00

Yes, men here are always talking about how 80% of women choose 20% of men, but even if it were true, what do you want us to do about it? Choose men we don’t like and aren’t attracted to? All you men can do is try to make yourself a better choice. That’s it.

_H_a_c_k_e_r_ · 2024-09-30T16:04:03+00:00

This also means any harm they face due to their selection is consequence of their own choice. And they should not be entitled to any sympathy for burden of their role as their selection privilege comes with that burden.

TheAvocadoSlayer · 2024-09-30T18:33:02+00:00

Women aren’t usually thinking about their genes when they’re having casual sex.

Gold_Supermarket1956 · 2024-10-01T18:34:17+00:00

Except most become single moms so their not picking off of who could be a better partner or father their picking off of who makes my pussy the wettest

Tryagain409 · 2024-10-01T16:21:11+00:00

But you're talking about natural selection. That implies evolution and nature. An animal won't just quietly give up and go mate less. They'd fight for it.

ProfessorOilNGas · 2024-10-01T17:36:09+00:00

Absolutely. If I were a woman, I would not settle for a man as unattractive in so many ways as I am. A woman who is willing to settle for me would have much lower standards than mine. Anyone with standards that low probably has a serious problem, and I prefer to avoid women with serious problems.

Again, absolutely. This realization led to my salvation. It really did. I realized that, in all probability, I could never get a woman. And even if I eventually did, that woman would never meet the threshold to make me physcially attracted to her. That's not to say I wouldn't respect and care for her as I would any person I count as a friend, but the attraction just wouldn't be there.

So? Why is this news? Well, I've been interested in trying to provide self-analysis tools to spare those who will never be able to make it romantically (some uncharitable people harshly say "loserguys") at least part of the pain chasing the unobtainable. One criticism of my "cut your losses and move on approach" is that, if one is willing to lower his standards enough, one can get somebody. My retort, however, is that, while this may be true, what those of us on the bottom of the Sexual Market Value (SMV) end up with simply will not fit the bill if our threshold of attraction is too high. In other words, if you got caviar tastes and a pizza face, you WILL NOT EVER attract a person you find attractive.

I think for people like us, this bitter pill must be swallowed, and the earlier the better. I agree with you. I think alot of the unfortunate anti-woman rhetoric one hears here comes from men suffering some kind of psychic hernia wherein they aren't facing up to the fact that, in this life at least, they will never attract a woman they find attractive. Happily, I think there is a small body of older guys with good advice to give. I'm not saying it's all good, but sound, unemotional acceptance of reality is the strong suit of age. Blaming women for being attracted to who they are attracted to, calling them shallow or worse, when it ain't you, and all the other related mysogynistic blather are bleeding these guys of time and happiness. Get busy.

Most_Read_1330 · 2024-10-01T17:55:59+00:00

They do a bad job picking considering how many single mothers there are out there.

ARealScarletPrince · 2024-10-01T19:42:18+00:00

Yeah, because women are just so good at choosing 'worthy' men. Totally not Chads who just leave them and the children. What a joke!

BargainBard · 2024-10-01T22:21:08+00:00

It is when a good chunk of women have unrealistic standards.

That graph from OK Cupid where women rated 80% of men as under average, speaks volumes of which gender needs a ego check and which one needs a ego boost.

AsparagusThis7044 · 2024-10-01T22:54:23+00:00

If natural selection (or anything) is good because it’s natural then why aren’t you living in a cave? Hypocrite.

FrameWorried8852 · 2024-10-01T15:43:27+00:00

Tell women that

Regular_Journalist_5 · 2024-10-01T15:57:57+00:00

Try getting a man with no hope of romantic success to do military service of any kind. I would rather do the jail time, or just learn to speak Mandarin. good luck ladies

bison5595 · 2024-10-01T23:13:15+00:00

I don’t disagree with the logic that women have to be risky due to the possibility of getting pregnant. I’m curious, if women are supposed to be picky, why can’t we judge women with high body counts. You are risking your health and pregnancy with multiple men

Equal_Simple5899 · 2024-10-03T03:13:46+00:00

It's not necessarily natural selection per se. I mean it is but it isn't.

At the end of the day it's about what is good for society.

Having children with a man that will dump the child on the women, not raise them, let them fend for themselves like as animals ect produces poor offspring for society.

Single motherhood (fatherlessness) is associated with a higher chance of being a criminal. Criminals are a burden on society.

Having children with a good man that can raise a family well produces functional offspring in society. Not always but it increases the likelihood.

Birth control has messed up this dynamic as now people choose partners for "love" ect instead of whether or not they would be a good partner/parent to raise children with.

So now we have high numbers of children of divorce or single parent homes. And society is becoming like a jungle.

empireofadhd · 2024-10-05T15:46:08+00:00

I have huge problems with this sentiment. It’s like saying it’s a natural order for women to stay in the kitchen. That some or many men fail in romantic relationships is a social construct, and it’s in large part constructed by feminists and the educational system which favors women.

When women are suffering it’s all due to social constructs which needs to be dismantled. When men suffers its natural selection. You sound like a nazi.

Intelligent-Insight · 2024-09-30T17:41:48+00:00

> that we all must accept.

Why would we do that? We already didn't really accept the minority of men getting almost all women and enforced religion and monogamy. Which is why you have electricity and the internet to be typing this. You think now is the time to not let most contributing men reproduce? Idk, it might take a while, but this won't end well. And when it doesn't, one can only imagine what solution we will come up with. But I'm pretty sure it won't be the one where humanity degrades just so women can keep being selective.

Upset-Hat4199 · 2024-09-30T18:30:26+00:00

This is totally wrong. If a man cannot attract women there is something or many things deeply wrong about him.

Women dictate your worth in society and if a man is repellant to them, there is likely an extensive list of things wrong with him that he ought to fix

You can’t just ignore it if no one finds you attractive, you should work to become more desirable and make yourself worthy of women.

“I’m going to give up on women, women have too high standards” - that’s the mark of a very pathetic man

Excellent_Hotel381 · 2024-09-30T19:23:27+00:00

I used to think that women were very picky and selective until I started dating other men and saw this from the other side. I'm a bisexual male who was married to a woman and dated women most of my life until recently. After my divorce, I started exploring my bisexual side and also started to dress in a more feminine way. Not like drag or anything but I no longer look like typical male either.

All my life, other men used to give me space and mutual respect. Now, even though I am taller than most other guys, that is gone! Men size each other up all the time but it's usually with respect, now it feels like a predator sizing up prey, it's dismissive. I can have my personal space intruded on, get rude comments and generally feel less safe, just by how I look.

Two things I’ve noticed that guys don’t understand about what women deal with daily: First, there are so many guys trying to get your attention, and most of them are crude or just looking for sex. Second, a lot of guys give off dangerous or creepy vibes, treating you like someone beneath them who doesn’t deserve respect.

From a guy's perspective, like the OP's post, they think women are super picky and they failed this sort of Darwin Hunger Games test and they weren't selected.

From a woman's perspective (if I may be so bold) She needs to feel safe and make sure you are not a creep FIRST, before she is open to feeling romantic vibes and deciding if she likes you that way.

Women can absolutely tell me if I am full of shit, this is just my perspective as a bisexual guy who was raised and socialized as male and had a brief window into what women deal with

Myagooshki2 · 2024-09-30T20:15:12+00:00

"people shouldn't try to stop cancer, that's just mother nature doing its work"

Female attraction is triggered by specific things. They're not comparing you to other men, they're comparing you to themselves. Women don't "pareto" the 80/20. Honestly, they're not logical enough to do that lol. There is more than enough room in this world for more women to be attracted to more men and vice versa. When specific things happen, females become attracted to male x.

balhaegu · 2024-10-02T03:10:40+00:00

There is nothing wrong. But it will lead to decline of that society. And then a stronger society will take over. And that stronger society will have men who are motivated, family oriented, and rewarded for their contributions and sacrifices.

ClevelandSpigot · 2024-10-02T17:10:09+00:00

We could reverse what you said above, and say that there is nothing wrong with a man having sex with a woman, but not offering her a relationship.

Well, as I heard someone say one time, "Sex is like air. It's not a problem, until you don't have enough."

Old-Passenger-3897 · 2024-10-04T20:19:42+00:00

I think part that is overlooked in mindset. I got out of prison in January and I got out of the halfway house May 28th.

By June 7th or 8th I already knew I was gonna pull this hot chick at work. I'm average looking came out of halfway house with nothing not even clothes.

Now granted it only lasted 2 and a half months. I can pull them fairly decently j just have trouble keeping them 😆 🤣

obviousredflag · 2024-09-30T15:56:17+00:00

I think it is wrong to shame men who don't get selected by women because being unchosen is a consequence of natural selection that we all must accept.

What do you think is the reason that shaming exists? We can't get rid of it. It's a necessary tool for our societies.

There is nothing shameful about being unchosen by women since that's just how mother nature does her work.

Of course it's shameful to be the worst at the most important thing that basically everyone else succeeds at.

Ragtime-Rochelle · 2024-10-01T06:17:06+00:00

Every blackpiller I've ever known refuses to date anything less than a supermodel. I'm not necessarily saying lower your standards but there's plenty of fish in the sea. You just gotta cast a wider net.

Consider dating:

Women outside your race
Women below your income level
Older women
Disabled women
Neurodivergent women
Women outside your religion
Overweight women
Disfigured women
Trans women
If you just want casual sex, try men. Seriously, a twink can do pretty much anything a woman can. Maybe you're not into it but you won't know until you try.

Hell, you cast a much wider net if you just consider women who aren't fully conventionally attractive. You might actually get your dick sucked for once in your life.

'No. I don't wanna do any of that. I only want my shortstack big booty anime bishojo'. Ok well, learn to love sex toys, learn to love porn, learn to love jerking off, learn to love prostitutes. Just stfu about being an incel.

Title	There is nothing wrong with not being selected by women
Author	AresThePacifist_
Upvotes	76
Comments	1199
Date	September 30, 2024 3:38 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1fsykaj/there_is_nothing_wrong_with_not_being_selected_by/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/there-is-nothing-wrong-with-not-being-selected-by.1531372 https://theredarchive.com/post/1531372

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